1
00:00:05,210 --> 00:00:02,330
this week on the show live from Michigan

2
00:00:07,010 --> 00:00:05,220
UFO Con with Nick Redfern that was

3
00:00:10,370 --> 00:00:07,020
really the kind of the start of it all

4
00:00:12,620 --> 00:00:10,380
when US intelligence sort of started to

5
00:00:15,049 --> 00:00:12,630
get their head around wow you know there

6
00:00:17,150 --> 00:00:15,059
are real year if I was up there but

7
00:00:19,390 --> 00:00:17,160
there's a possibility using like

8
00:00:23,179 --> 00:00:19,400
psychological warfare and disinformation

9
00:00:27,130 --> 00:00:23,189
that the Russians are now using this

10
00:00:30,200 --> 00:00:27,140
real phenomenon as a means to kickstart

11
00:00:31,970 --> 00:00:30,210
communism within the UFO field which was

12
00:00:44,030 --> 00:00:31,980
important because at that time I said it

13
00:00:46,470 --> 00:00:44,040
was a huge movement this is somewhere in

14
00:01:08,450 --> 00:00:46,480
the skies the brain space

15
00:01:12,770 --> 00:01:10,700
welcome to somewhere in the skies I'm

16
00:01:15,170 --> 00:01:12,780
your host Ryan Sprague I recently

17
00:01:17,510 --> 00:01:15,180
attended the Michigan UFO Con in

18
00:01:20,060 --> 00:01:17,520
Houghton Lake Michigan it was honestly

19
00:01:22,160 --> 00:01:20,070
one of the best experiences of my life I

20
00:01:23,990 --> 00:01:22,170
met some of the most amazing people over

21
00:01:26,270 --> 00:01:24,000
the weekend and made some awesome new

22
00:01:28,940 --> 00:01:26,280
friends one of those friends turned

23
00:01:30,740 --> 00:01:28,950
colleague was Nick Redfern you've heard

24
00:01:32,810 --> 00:01:30,750
him on the show in the past but this was

25
00:01:34,910 --> 00:01:32,820
personally my first time meeting him

26
00:01:37,130 --> 00:01:34,920
face to face and I had the opportunity

27
00:01:39,590 --> 00:01:37,140
to sit down with him for an in-depth

28
00:01:42,440 --> 00:01:39,600
discussion about his new book flying

29
00:01:44,480 --> 00:01:42,450
saucers from the Kremlin the book is a

30
00:01:47,060 --> 00:01:44,490
study of how and why Russian

31
00:01:49,940 --> 00:01:47,070
intelligence used the UFO phenomenon as

32
00:01:52,670 --> 00:01:49,950
a means to try to create fear hysteria

33
00:01:55,850 --> 00:01:52,680
in paranoia in the United States and

34
00:01:59,749 --> 00:01:55,860
beyond from the Roswell crash and mj-12

35
00:02:03,200 --> 00:01:59,759
documents to area 51 and the contactees

36
00:02:05,780 --> 00:02:03,210
of yesteryear were and our UFO

37
00:02:08,570 --> 00:02:05,790
researchers being monitored by foreign

38
00:02:11,690 --> 00:02:08,580
and domestic intelligence agencies and

39
00:02:15,140 --> 00:02:11,700
how far does the manipulation and

40
00:02:18,770 --> 00:02:15,150
meddling truly go with the UFO topic and

41
00:02:21,530 --> 00:02:18,780
beyond in today's Internet age we dig

42
00:02:24,470 --> 00:02:21,540
deep into how and why Russia used the

43
00:02:27,500 --> 00:02:24,480
UFO phenomenon and keen interest in it

44
00:02:31,009 --> 00:02:27,510
as an advantageous weapon of belief

45
00:02:32,420 --> 00:02:31,019
it's all here in our Michigan UFO con

46
00:02:36,730 --> 00:02:32,430
sit down

47
00:02:41,270 --> 00:02:39,080
alright guys Ryan Sprague here once

48
00:02:43,520 --> 00:02:41,280
again for somewhere in the skies coming

49
00:02:46,220 --> 00:02:43,530
to you live from the Michigan UFO

50
00:02:48,110 --> 00:02:46,230
contact event and with me right now is a

51
00:02:51,199 --> 00:02:48,120
gentleman that I have been dying to meet

52
00:02:54,050 --> 00:02:51,209
for years now and finally it's happened

53
00:02:55,820 --> 00:02:54,060
that is Nick Redfern Nick how's it goin

54
00:02:57,740 --> 00:02:55,830
brother hey Ryan it's good thanks have

55
00:02:59,420 --> 00:02:57,750
another time yeah it's been pretty cool

56
00:03:01,430 --> 00:02:59,430
so far I didn't know what to expect

57
00:03:04,100 --> 00:03:01,440
coming here but I saw that you had

58
00:03:05,750 --> 00:03:04,110
spoken at this event last year I saw you

59
00:03:07,309 --> 00:03:05,760
on the list this year with a couple

60
00:03:09,740 --> 00:03:07,319
other people that I've been dying to

61
00:03:11,210 --> 00:03:09,750
meet so this is a big one for me

62
00:03:13,729 --> 00:03:11,220
well it's good I mean it's a good

63
00:03:14,960 --> 00:03:13,739
conference because yes well-organized

64
00:03:17,420 --> 00:03:14,970
which is a hoser

65
00:03:19,160 --> 00:03:17,430
you know sort of an important thing when

66
00:03:21,740 --> 00:03:19,170
you go to these events right but also

67
00:03:23,990 --> 00:03:21,750
there's a good variation of subjects

68
00:03:26,090 --> 00:03:24,000
it's not like everybody's doing similar

69
00:03:28,820 --> 00:03:26,100
stuff you know and I think particularly

70
00:03:32,600 --> 00:03:28,830
for the audience that's a good thing you

71
00:03:35,479 --> 00:03:32,610
know they they get a lecture on hoaxing

72
00:03:37,670 --> 00:03:35,489
and photographs somebody else is doing a

73
00:03:39,650 --> 00:03:37,680
historical case you know so I'm just

74
00:03:43,690 --> 00:03:39,660
talking about this sort of that and I

75
00:03:47,750 --> 00:03:43,700
think that kind of keeps people

76
00:03:49,640 --> 00:03:47,760
intrigued you know and sort of they're

77
00:03:51,830 --> 00:03:49,650
gonna keep on listening because there's

78
00:03:54,349 --> 00:03:51,840
so many different things that people are

79
00:03:57,080 --> 00:03:54,359
talking about so yeah it's just so

80
00:03:59,599 --> 00:03:57,090
always good and it's a nice venue

81
00:04:01,670 --> 00:03:59,609
Oh beautiful without in Lake Michigan

82
00:04:04,460 --> 00:04:01,680
we're in right on the water it's a

83
00:04:07,220 --> 00:04:04,470
perfect setting for any UFOs that have

84
00:04:10,190 --> 00:04:07,230
you know a good point though the

85
00:04:13,130 --> 00:04:10,200
variation of topics discussed with in

86
00:04:15,530 --> 00:04:13,140
ufology here I mean you have people who

87
00:04:17,840 --> 00:04:15,540
are talking for MUFON you have people

88
00:04:21,289 --> 00:04:17,850
who are here talking strictly about data

89
00:04:22,610 --> 00:04:21,299
and statistics with UFOs and then you've

90
00:04:24,890 --> 00:04:22,620
got people talking about actual

91
00:04:27,350 --> 00:04:24,900
experiences so kind of mixing and

92
00:04:29,659 --> 00:04:27,360
melding all that research together and

93
00:04:32,240 --> 00:04:29,669
working together instead of a part you

94
00:04:34,879 --> 00:04:32,250
know there's so many different factions

95
00:04:36,890 --> 00:04:34,889
within these research communities and

96
00:04:39,710 --> 00:04:36,900
people not willing to share their

97
00:04:41,990 --> 00:04:39,720
information so it's pretty refreshing to

98
00:04:44,930 --> 00:04:42,000
see everyone on the same page of an

99
00:04:46,820 --> 00:04:44,940
event like that yeah and I think you

100
00:04:48,390 --> 00:04:46,830
know the guys are like a sense of like

101
00:04:50,879 --> 00:04:48,400
community every

102
00:04:52,820 --> 00:04:50,889
funny sort of all we're all in it

103
00:04:55,290 --> 00:04:52,830
together you know somebody's lecturing

104
00:04:57,620 --> 00:04:55,300
somebody saying for the first time and

105
00:05:00,270 --> 00:04:57,630
they want to know what is all all about

106
00:05:02,010 --> 00:05:00,280
you know somebody may have come along

107
00:05:04,560 --> 00:05:02,020
because they they know that there's one

108
00:05:07,050 --> 00:05:04,570
of their favorite stories he's gonna be

109
00:05:09,659 --> 00:05:07,060
discussed so I think you know people

110
00:05:10,980 --> 00:05:09,669
have a lot of different motivations to

111
00:05:13,350 --> 00:05:10,990
coming to these events

112
00:05:15,499 --> 00:05:13,360
maybe somebody happens to see a UFO

113
00:05:18,210 --> 00:05:15,509
somewhere over Michigan last week

114
00:05:20,310 --> 00:05:18,220
realize there was a UFO geek coming

115
00:05:22,439 --> 00:05:20,320
along oh my god I gotta go and see that

116
00:05:24,000 --> 00:05:22,449
you know that's a good point you know

117
00:05:25,890 --> 00:05:24,010
you never know who's gonna come out of

118
00:05:27,450 --> 00:05:25,900
the woodwork and have a story to tell

119
00:05:29,460 --> 00:05:27,460
that's what I love about these offenses

120
00:05:31,439 --> 00:05:29,470
and when you're done talking someone

121
00:05:34,439 --> 00:05:31,449
comes up to you and I got a story to

122
00:05:36,240 --> 00:05:34,449
tell you so you know it's it's it's

123
00:05:38,460 --> 00:05:36,250
refreshing to know that you know it's

124
00:05:39,710 --> 00:05:38,470
not just these old cases that we've gone

125
00:05:42,240 --> 00:05:39,720
over a million times

126
00:05:45,240 --> 00:05:42,250
Roswell Rendlesham blah blah blah and

127
00:05:47,370 --> 00:05:45,250
there's stuff still going on yeah and

128
00:05:50,760 --> 00:05:47,380
you know sort of the most recent thing

129
00:05:54,060 --> 00:05:50,770
in I guess the UFO field lately has been

130
00:05:56,490 --> 00:05:54,070
this storm area51 event that happened

131
00:05:58,560 --> 00:05:56,500
yesterday have you heard any rumblings

132
00:06:01,529 --> 00:05:58,570
about how long I haven't but I do have

133
00:06:04,620 --> 00:06:01,539
my opinions on it all yeah and yeah I

134
00:06:08,909 --> 00:06:04,630
mean everybody knew fala G has heard of

135
00:06:11,640 --> 00:06:08,919
area 51 but also everybody just about in

136
00:06:13,680 --> 00:06:11,650
the public has heard of area 51

137
00:06:16,350 --> 00:06:13,690
regardless of whether you know their

138
00:06:19,469 --> 00:06:16,360
interest in UFOs or not people know that

139
00:06:21,210 --> 00:06:19,479
area 51 is like this sacred base out

140
00:06:23,820 --> 00:06:21,220
somewhere in the desert so it's to

141
00:06:26,939 --> 00:06:23,830
connect with UFOs just by everybody now

142
00:06:29,969 --> 00:06:26,949
has done that and I love it all and and

143
00:06:31,920 --> 00:06:29,979
I understand why people want the answers

144
00:06:35,550 --> 00:06:31,930
because they've been strange lights over

145
00:06:38,399 --> 00:06:35,560
area 51 people climate of work there and

146
00:06:41,399 --> 00:06:38,409
and said they saw this they saw that

147
00:06:44,219 --> 00:06:41,409
flying saucers dead aliens live aliens

148
00:06:49,439 --> 00:06:44,229
whatever so it's developed this sort of

149
00:06:51,180 --> 00:06:49,449
pop culture and ándale if you like and

150
00:06:54,060 --> 00:06:51,190
it's also become almost like a piece of

151
00:06:57,600 --> 00:06:54,070
Americana in oh yeah in its own strange

152
00:07:00,620 --> 00:06:57,610
way and I think for that reason it's

153
00:07:04,240 --> 00:07:00,630
become sort of a hotbed for people who

154
00:07:07,580 --> 00:07:04,250
go along to the to the base and sort of

155
00:07:10,250 --> 00:07:07,590
test the security personality and say

156
00:07:12,740 --> 00:07:10,260
you know basically how close can I get

157
00:07:15,680 --> 00:07:12,750
before I get you know pulled away in

158
00:07:18,170 --> 00:07:15,690
handcuffs real whatever and and people

159
00:07:21,170 --> 00:07:18,180
have been arrested you know and fine and

160
00:07:24,740 --> 00:07:21,180
just thrown in the slammer for 24 hours

161
00:07:26,510 --> 00:07:24,750
to teach him a lesson now for me it's I

162
00:07:28,160 --> 00:07:26,520
think it's fine to sort of go up to the

163
00:07:30,620 --> 00:07:28,170
little alien you know and hang out with

164
00:07:32,000 --> 00:07:30,630
a bunch of people talk about area 51 get

165
00:07:34,970 --> 00:07:32,010
some pictures of the mountains and all

166
00:07:38,330 --> 00:07:34,980
that but when people talk about storm in

167
00:07:40,880 --> 00:07:38,340
the base I mean I draw the parallel what

168
00:07:42,590 --> 00:07:40,890
would people say if a group of people

169
00:07:45,680 --> 00:07:42,600
got together and said we're gonna storm

170
00:07:47,780 --> 00:07:45,690
the Pentagon you know and and they

171
00:07:50,030 --> 00:07:47,790
actually tried to do it well that'd be

172
00:07:51,890 --> 00:07:50,040
like a major national security issue

173
00:07:55,370 --> 00:07:51,900
that if five hundred people got together

174
00:07:57,260 --> 00:07:55,380
and tried to invade the Pentagon and I

175
00:08:00,170 --> 00:07:57,270
take the view that it's no different

176
00:08:02,210 --> 00:08:00,180
that in today's world regardless of the

177
00:08:06,650 --> 00:08:02,220
fact that you want to find the answers

178
00:08:09,680 --> 00:08:06,660
to area 51 for me breaking into a US

179
00:08:12,440 --> 00:08:09,690
military base is not the way to do it

180
00:08:15,470 --> 00:08:12,450
because it's reckless it's dangerous and

181
00:08:18,050 --> 00:08:15,480
in the state the worlds in now having

182
00:08:18,890 --> 00:08:18,060
people invade a military base could get

183
00:08:21,410 --> 00:08:18,900
your head blown off

184
00:08:24,370 --> 00:08:21,420
Oh absent and there's also the fact you

185
00:08:27,620 --> 00:08:24,380
know the little-known fact that people

186
00:08:31,250 --> 00:08:27,630
may not be aware of or the possibility

187
00:08:35,360 --> 00:08:31,260
not the fact is that who's to say you

188
00:08:37,760 --> 00:08:35,370
know this keeps on happening and you

189
00:08:39,589 --> 00:08:37,770
know there's numerous people involved

190
00:08:42,620 --> 00:08:39,599
well who's to say that some of those

191
00:08:45,350 --> 00:08:42,630
aren't plants from somewhere else right

192
00:08:46,910 --> 00:08:45,360
you know Russia who knows I mean that

193
00:08:50,080 --> 00:08:46,920
might sound a bit paranoid but it would

194
00:08:56,840 --> 00:08:50,090
be the perfect place for those people to

195
00:08:59,300 --> 00:08:56,850
infiltrate like a UFO group hundreds of

196
00:09:01,460 --> 00:08:59,310
people and take a bunch of pictures and

197
00:09:05,300 --> 00:09:01,470
and if they're questioned you know oh

198
00:09:08,450 --> 00:09:05,310
you know I'm Hank from North Dakota when

199
00:09:11,660 --> 00:09:08,460
you're actually you know Ivan from

200
00:09:14,060 --> 00:09:11,670
the muscari right you know and I mean we

201
00:09:15,200 --> 00:09:14,070
could look at the the joke inside on it

202
00:09:20,079 --> 00:09:15,210
but it for me

203
00:09:23,329 --> 00:09:20,089
it comes down to it's almost like

204
00:09:25,880 --> 00:09:23,339
suggesting the people should break into

205
00:09:29,000 --> 00:09:25,890
an invade military bases on US dollar

206
00:09:31,910 --> 00:09:29,010
soil and I think that for me is crossing

207
00:09:33,829 --> 00:09:31,920
the line too far oh absolutely yeah we

208
00:09:37,550 --> 00:09:33,839
live in an age of social networking

209
00:09:40,820 --> 00:09:37,560
where people will do the dumbest things

210
00:09:44,360 --> 00:09:40,830
for clicks now or a YouTube view or an

211
00:09:47,000 --> 00:09:44,370
Instagram like all these fake things

212
00:09:50,480 --> 00:09:47,010
that we've built up to be so much in our

213
00:09:53,750 --> 00:09:50,490
human existence name so who's to say

214
00:09:56,870 --> 00:09:53,760
that one person isn't gonna try to run

215
00:09:58,790 --> 00:09:56,880
over that gate just for a video yeah

216
00:10:01,130 --> 00:09:58,800
that's the issue I have you know and

217
00:10:02,269 --> 00:10:01,140
they say well most people know that it's

218
00:10:03,949 --> 00:10:02,279
just a bit of fun

219
00:10:05,329 --> 00:10:03,959
and most people probably just gonna sit

220
00:10:07,670 --> 00:10:05,339
on the desert floor look at the Stars

221
00:10:11,870 --> 00:10:07,680
and hope they see something weird but

222
00:10:14,420 --> 00:10:11,880
there's always some guy who takes it too

223
00:10:16,579 --> 00:10:14,430
far and that is the person who's gonna

224
00:10:18,380 --> 00:10:16,589
make the news yeah you know when they

225
00:10:19,910 --> 00:10:18,390
just keep running and running through

226
00:10:21,860 --> 00:10:19,920
the desert or whatever that kind of

227
00:10:26,300 --> 00:10:21,870
thing yeah and that's where the damage

228
00:10:28,610 --> 00:10:26,310
could occur right so my view is that the

229
00:10:31,210 --> 00:10:28,620
plenty of ways to sort of research and

230
00:10:34,100 --> 00:10:31,220
investigate the history of area 51 and

231
00:10:36,920 --> 00:10:34,110
if people come forward claim to work for

232
00:10:39,199 --> 00:10:36,930
them you know deeply investigate their

233
00:10:41,000 --> 00:10:39,209
story and I think what Jason Moon is

234
00:10:43,850 --> 00:10:41,010
ignored is it's somewhere in between and

235
00:10:46,640 --> 00:10:43,860
I think the best way to approach it is

236
00:10:50,000 --> 00:10:46,650
to like a journalistic approach the

237
00:10:52,280 --> 00:10:50,010
wrong approach is to try and haul

238
00:10:55,430 --> 00:10:52,290
yourself over a fence and just keep on

239
00:10:57,710 --> 00:10:55,440
going and going until you see let's be

240
00:10:59,210 --> 00:10:57,720
honest you know I don't mean people a

241
00:11:01,610 --> 00:10:59,220
lot of people forget that when you get

242
00:11:03,800 --> 00:11:01,620
to like the little alien and you get to

243
00:11:05,540 --> 00:11:03,810
the you know the points where you've got

244
00:11:07,010 --> 00:11:05,550
the security person and they'll turn you

245
00:11:09,949 --> 00:11:07,020
around a lot of people don't realize

246
00:11:12,440 --> 00:11:09,959
you've still got like another 8 9 10

247
00:11:14,569 --> 00:11:12,450
miles whatever it is before you actually

248
00:11:17,300 --> 00:11:14,579
get to what you would consider to be

249
00:11:19,519 --> 00:11:17,310
area 51 you know people think when they

250
00:11:21,800 --> 00:11:19,529
get stopped there that's like the start

251
00:11:22,670 --> 00:11:21,810
of area 51 well what it really is it's

252
00:11:27,380 --> 00:11:22,680
the

253
00:11:31,220 --> 00:11:27,390
on going for miles and miles so that's

254
00:11:33,890 --> 00:11:31,230
why it's almost impossible to to get

255
00:11:37,640 --> 00:11:33,900
there but yeah yeah I mean that that's

256
00:11:40,610 --> 00:11:37,650
my view that's do do an investigation

257
00:11:43,280 --> 00:11:40,620
from a journalistic perspective because

258
00:11:46,460 --> 00:11:43,290
if you follow you know this sort of

259
00:11:49,190 --> 00:11:46,470
storming angle not only could you get

260
00:11:51,050 --> 00:11:49,200
your head blown off but you know you

261
00:11:52,910 --> 00:11:51,060
followed and people might find what I'm

262
00:11:54,920 --> 00:11:52,920
gonna say now if it's controversial but

263
00:11:58,400 --> 00:11:54,930
I think it's also true if you follow

264
00:12:01,760 --> 00:11:58,410
just start breaking or into military

265
00:12:03,410 --> 00:12:01,770
bases or threaten to storm them well

266
00:12:07,010 --> 00:12:03,420
that could put you follow gist unlike a

267
00:12:08,750 --> 00:12:07,020
national security watch list yeah we all

268
00:12:12,860 --> 00:12:08,760
go down because they want to because

269
00:12:15,440 --> 00:12:12,870
somebody some stupid guy decided he was

270
00:12:18,140 --> 00:12:15,450
gonna be try and be the one who gets to

271
00:12:21,170 --> 00:12:18,150
the base and finds the dead aliens and

272
00:12:23,450 --> 00:12:21,180
all this you know so but yeah I haven't

273
00:12:25,670 --> 00:12:23,460
actually heard anything you know as to

274
00:12:28,070 --> 00:12:25,680
what's gone down i I've heard rumblings

275
00:12:30,920 --> 00:12:28,080
you know the turnout was not that good

276
00:12:33,130 --> 00:12:30,930
I've heard that there's more people at

277
00:12:36,230 --> 00:12:33,140
this event with a here in Michigan

278
00:12:37,670 --> 00:12:36,240
otherwise you know so maybe at the end

279
00:12:40,820 --> 00:12:37,680
of the day it was pretty anticlimactic

280
00:12:43,940 --> 00:12:40,830
but that's the thing this was all a joke

281
00:12:46,010 --> 00:12:43,950
to begin with well it was but the

282
00:12:49,010 --> 00:12:46,020
important thing is you know people make

283
00:12:50,870 --> 00:12:49,020
jokes and somebody acts acts on it now

284
00:12:53,660 --> 00:12:50,880
and again run and you only need one

285
00:12:56,060 --> 00:12:53,670
person it so act on it and people will

286
00:12:57,560 --> 00:12:56,070
remember that they won't remember L was

287
00:12:59,750 --> 00:12:57,570
all a joke they'll remember the thing

288
00:13:01,910 --> 00:12:59,760
that this one person did itself a really

289
00:13:05,450 --> 00:13:01,920
really good point well sort of

290
00:13:07,430 --> 00:13:05,460
transitioning you did mention planting

291
00:13:10,850 --> 00:13:07,440
people mmm you know this idea of

292
00:13:14,150 --> 00:13:10,860
planting people into certain groups or

293
00:13:16,340 --> 00:13:14,160
or countries for information were to

294
00:13:19,640 --> 00:13:16,350
influence and that's kind of the the

295
00:13:21,980 --> 00:13:19,650
center of your talk here at the Michigan

296
00:13:25,310 --> 00:13:21,990
contact event and your new book and

297
00:13:27,620 --> 00:13:25,320
flying saucers from the Kremlin so I'd

298
00:13:29,120 --> 00:13:27,630
like to discuss a little bit about that

299
00:13:31,670 --> 00:13:29,130
with you now if you don't mind Nick um

300
00:13:34,460 --> 00:13:31,680
what made you want to write this book in

301
00:13:35,110 --> 00:13:34,470
the first place well over the years you

302
00:13:36,880 --> 00:13:35,120
know I got

303
00:13:39,730 --> 00:13:36,890
if it's here and there and sometimes

304
00:13:43,269 --> 00:13:39,740
more far more than snippets of how the

305
00:13:45,550 --> 00:13:43,279
Russians were perceived by US

306
00:13:48,940 --> 00:13:45,560
intelligence in the Cold War as trying

307
00:13:52,720 --> 00:13:48,950
to infiltrate the United States and you

308
00:13:56,890 --> 00:13:52,730
or and manipulating the mindset of the

309
00:13:59,890 --> 00:13:56,900
u.s. population to try and sort of seed

310
00:14:03,760 --> 00:13:59,900
and indoctrinate communism into the u.s.

311
00:14:06,070 --> 00:14:03,770
and find alternative ways to do it and

312
00:14:09,250 --> 00:14:06,080
some of those alternative ways actually

313
00:14:13,390 --> 00:14:09,260
involved flying saucers and UFOs in a

314
00:14:15,120 --> 00:14:13,400
really weird way yeah for example in the

315
00:14:18,160 --> 00:14:15,130
early 1950s you know with the whole

316
00:14:21,210 --> 00:14:18,170
contactee movement the space brothers

317
00:14:24,519 --> 00:14:21,220
you know these peace you know sort of

318
00:14:26,980 --> 00:14:24,529
friendly peaceful long-haired aliens

319
00:14:30,480 --> 00:14:26,990
kind of looking pretty much like us with

320
00:14:32,860 --> 00:14:30,490
a few slight differences you know and

321
00:14:35,620 --> 00:14:32,870
typically they would meet people out in

322
00:14:39,550 --> 00:14:35,630
desert locations California New Mexico

323
00:14:42,430 --> 00:14:39,560
Arizona and Utah and so on and you know

324
00:14:45,519 --> 00:14:42,440
it's a typical dead Debu Stood Still

325
00:14:47,019 --> 00:14:45,529
flying saucer comes down and you know

326
00:14:49,030 --> 00:14:47,029
this human looking ailing to come out

327
00:14:53,320 --> 00:14:49,040
and target certain people say you're

328
00:14:57,130 --> 00:14:53,330
gonna help us on our on our Road if you

329
00:15:01,540 --> 00:14:57,140
like to help your planet from destroying

330
00:15:04,150 --> 00:15:01,550
itself and so it was very much like like

331
00:15:06,400 --> 00:15:04,160
a like a peaceful kind of approach she

332
00:15:08,680 --> 00:15:06,410
wasn't some abductions you know where

333
00:15:09,730 --> 00:15:08,690
people traumatized and the memories of

334
00:15:12,730 --> 00:15:09,740
life and so on

335
00:15:14,410 --> 00:15:12,740
and a lot of these people kind of went

336
00:15:17,650 --> 00:15:14,420
on that path like probably the most

337
00:15:19,329 --> 00:15:17,660
famous one George Adamski whose first

338
00:15:21,850 --> 00:15:19,339
book came out well not his first book

339
00:15:28,240 --> 00:15:21,860
but his first non-fiction book if it was

340
00:15:31,090 --> 00:15:28,250
nonfiction yeah in 1953 now a lot of

341
00:15:33,579 --> 00:15:31,100
people don't know that's a damn scheme

342
00:15:36,340 --> 00:15:33,589
he was heavily involved in sort of

343
00:15:38,860 --> 00:15:36,350
spiritual mind/body/spirit stuff going

344
00:15:41,680 --> 00:15:38,870
way back to the 1930s and actually had

345
00:15:45,610 --> 00:15:41,690
written a couple of books as well in

346
00:15:48,040 --> 00:15:45,620
that kind of theme now when he started

347
00:15:49,930 --> 00:15:48,050
to get involved in the UFO subjects

348
00:15:53,620 --> 00:15:49,940
most people probably don't know that he

349
00:15:55,150 --> 00:15:53,630
had a deep interest in communism and in

350
00:15:58,150 --> 00:15:55,160
some of his early lectures he talked

351
00:16:00,490 --> 00:15:58,160
about how the aliens the space brothers

352
00:16:02,650 --> 00:16:00,500
were probably communists which sounds

353
00:16:03,880 --> 00:16:02,660
like really weird and crazy but if

354
00:16:06,850 --> 00:16:03,890
that's what he said he said that they

355
00:16:08,410 --> 00:16:06,860
were probably were communists and then

356
00:16:10,300 --> 00:16:08,420
people said well what do you think about

357
00:16:12,970 --> 00:16:10,310
that and he said well he actually said

358
00:16:15,579 --> 00:16:12,980
communism is a good thing and he said it

359
00:16:18,100 --> 00:16:15,589
almost certainly Russia's gonna rule the

360
00:16:19,360 --> 00:16:18,110
world for a thousand years and there's

361
00:16:21,040 --> 00:16:19,370
gonna be paste throughout that period

362
00:16:23,980 --> 00:16:21,050
and he actually said that that's

363
00:16:24,759 --> 00:16:23,990
actually recorded in the FBI's files on

364
00:16:29,259 --> 00:16:24,769
a damn ski

365
00:16:32,139 --> 00:16:29,269
now if danske was just someone lecturing

366
00:16:33,910 --> 00:16:32,149
to five people and somebody's dug you

367
00:16:36,400 --> 00:16:33,920
know on a Sunday afternoon in a local

368
00:16:37,960 --> 00:16:36,410
library nobody would have cared if

369
00:16:39,910 --> 00:16:37,970
you're just him you know talking about

370
00:16:42,220 --> 00:16:39,920
this but that's not what happened his

371
00:16:46,960 --> 00:16:42,230
first book flying saucers have landed

372
00:16:49,840 --> 00:16:46,970
the the first publication the 125,000

373
00:16:51,910 --> 00:16:49,850
copies were sold just about yeah I mean

374
00:16:54,730 --> 00:16:51,920
it was a huge seller so you've got this

375
00:16:58,180 --> 00:16:54,740
guy who's selling his book in six

376
00:17:01,420 --> 00:16:58,190
figures of sales and he's talking about

377
00:17:04,659 --> 00:17:01,430
how aliens are communists and communism

378
00:17:08,370 --> 00:17:04,669
is good yeah and that's why the FBI got

379
00:17:12,040 --> 00:17:08,380
involved because their concern was that

380
00:17:15,730 --> 00:17:12,050
Adamski whether his claims were real or

381
00:17:19,840 --> 00:17:15,740
not the FBI began began to suspect that

382
00:17:22,659 --> 00:17:19,850
a danske was essentially spreading

383
00:17:25,240 --> 00:17:22,669
communism but doing so under a UFO

384
00:17:26,380 --> 00:17:25,250
banner and so you know he can kind of go

385
00:17:29,169 --> 00:17:26,390
under the radar

386
00:17:31,299 --> 00:17:29,179
oh I'm just you know doing a UFO lecture

387
00:17:33,490 --> 00:17:31,309
if the FBI comes along which they

388
00:17:37,360 --> 00:17:33,500
actually did several times they visited

389
00:17:38,980 --> 00:17:37,370
in Wow and and so you know he his

390
00:17:40,510 --> 00:17:38,990
argument was well I'm just a UFO

391
00:17:43,180 --> 00:17:40,520
researcher well no actually you're not

392
00:17:45,190 --> 00:17:43,190
you're a UFO researcher talking to

393
00:17:47,320 --> 00:17:45,200
hundreds of thousands of people and

394
00:17:50,409 --> 00:17:47,330
spreading communism that was the FBI's

395
00:17:53,830 --> 00:17:50,419
approach you can understand and they

396
00:17:56,320 --> 00:17:53,840
actually suspected that although he

397
00:18:00,220 --> 00:17:56,330
obviously wasn't a Russian spike was

398
00:18:01,290 --> 00:18:00,230
they did they did suspect on many

399
00:18:05,330 --> 00:18:01,300
occasions

400
00:18:09,210 --> 00:18:05,340
that he was actually sort of hired or

401
00:18:13,320 --> 00:18:09,220
agreed to sort of further this communist

402
00:18:15,150 --> 00:18:13,330
angle and to you know to target the UFL

403
00:18:16,440 --> 00:18:15,160
community which is actually huge back

404
00:18:19,080 --> 00:18:16,450
then because I mean some of the

405
00:18:21,870 --> 00:18:19,090
conferences like outer giant rock in

406
00:18:24,450 --> 00:18:21,880
California where George Van Tassel would

407
00:18:26,700 --> 00:18:24,460
put on these contact events they had on

408
00:18:30,030 --> 00:18:26,710
weekend events a lot ten to twelve

409
00:18:33,480 --> 00:18:30,040
thousand people which you know and today

410
00:18:34,740 --> 00:18:33,490
we get like three or four hundred you

411
00:18:37,350 --> 00:18:34,750
have to sort of look at it for that

412
00:18:42,060 --> 00:18:37,360
perspective that's you know twelve

413
00:18:44,910 --> 00:18:42,070
thousand people in say 1953-54 all of

414
00:18:46,590 --> 00:18:44,920
those people listening to communism is

415
00:18:50,430 --> 00:18:46,600
great you know peace-loving hippies

416
00:18:51,570 --> 00:18:50,440
types and all this kind of thing and you

417
00:18:54,540 --> 00:18:51,580
can see had that the big difference

418
00:18:57,690 --> 00:18:54,550
between today and now back then

419
00:18:59,820 --> 00:18:57,700
ufology was seen not by ufologists but

420
00:19:04,770 --> 00:18:59,830
by the FBI and some of the agencies as

421
00:19:07,860 --> 00:19:04,780
being a potential community that was

422
00:19:12,240 --> 00:19:07,870
ripe for manipulation by the Russians

423
00:19:16,170 --> 00:19:12,250
and so the FBI watch the damn scheme for

424
00:19:18,630 --> 00:19:16,180
a long long time in a brand about 1982

425
00:19:23,220 --> 00:19:18,640
they Declassified about seventy five

426
00:19:26,760 --> 00:19:23,230
pages of for fires of FBI files on a

427
00:19:28,200 --> 00:19:26,770
dance team and by probably I think about

428
00:19:31,920 --> 00:19:28,210
two thousand I think is about a hundred

429
00:19:33,990 --> 00:19:31,930
and fifty pages the V of the final file

430
00:19:35,970 --> 00:19:34,000
so as far as we know at least was

431
00:19:37,680 --> 00:19:35,980
actually Declassified about three months

432
00:19:42,440 --> 00:19:37,690
ago and that's just over four hundred

433
00:19:45,750 --> 00:19:42,450
pages a surveillance pipe documents on

434
00:19:50,040 --> 00:19:45,760
Adamski four hundred pages long spanning

435
00:19:53,970 --> 00:19:50,050
about 1949 to about rampant his

436
00:19:58,320 --> 00:19:53,980
death 1967 so you know you can see how

437
00:20:00,900 --> 00:19:58,330
easily and and why the FBI had these

438
00:20:02,850 --> 00:20:00,910
concerns now where the road whether or

439
00:20:06,030 --> 00:20:02,860
not he actually was you know being used

440
00:20:09,270 --> 00:20:06,040
by the Russians as a as a means to try

441
00:20:11,850 --> 00:20:09,280
and spread communism or was it just him

442
00:20:14,700 --> 00:20:11,860
saying it himself we don't know but the

443
00:20:21,030 --> 00:20:14,710
important thing is the FBI did recognize

444
00:20:24,450 --> 00:20:21,040
he's his ability to if you like real

445
00:20:27,150 --> 00:20:24,460
people in and say this is good that's

446
00:20:30,240 --> 00:20:27,160
bad so that was really the kind of the

447
00:20:32,580 --> 00:20:30,250
start of it all the when US intelligence

448
00:20:35,070 --> 00:20:32,590
sort of started to get their head around

449
00:20:37,520 --> 00:20:35,080
wow you know there are real year if I

450
00:20:40,110 --> 00:20:37,530
was up there but there's a possibility

451
00:20:43,220 --> 00:20:40,120
using like psychological warfare and

452
00:20:47,330 --> 00:20:43,230
disinformation that the Russians are now

453
00:20:51,240 --> 00:20:47,340
using this real phenomenon as a means to

454
00:20:53,310 --> 00:20:51,250
kickstart communism within the UFO field

455
00:20:55,680 --> 00:20:53,320
which was important because at that time

456
00:20:57,450 --> 00:20:55,690
I said it was a huge movement yeah you

457
00:21:00,060 --> 00:20:57,460
know in the Cold War

458
00:21:02,190 --> 00:21:00,070
yeah hate a bit yeah and then they tried

459
00:21:03,960 --> 00:21:02,200
a lot of other different obscure ways as

460
00:21:06,660 --> 00:21:03,970
well you know you followed you was just

461
00:21:10,770 --> 00:21:06,670
just war not just one way ya know in

462
00:21:14,630 --> 00:21:10,780
terms of you said we're not just talking

463
00:21:17,850 --> 00:21:14,640
using psychological warfare in terms of

464
00:21:20,100 --> 00:21:17,860
false information or disinformation or

465
00:21:23,010 --> 00:21:20,110
just you know pure fantasy we're talking

466
00:21:24,990 --> 00:21:23,020
also actual events I mean you you even

467
00:21:28,260 --> 00:21:25,000
talk in the book about going back to

468
00:21:30,390 --> 00:21:28,270
Roswell being sort of in Kenneth Arnold

469
00:21:32,550 --> 00:21:30,400
even being a part of this manipulation

470
00:21:34,380 --> 00:21:32,560
that the Russians may have been doing on

471
00:21:38,130 --> 00:21:34,390
the US could you maybe touch on that

472
00:21:40,770 --> 00:21:38,140
yeah I mean there's this I mean there's

473
00:21:44,310 --> 00:21:40,780
a very strange story concerning Roswell

474
00:21:47,760 --> 00:21:44,320
you know I mean the the idea that

475
00:21:50,370 --> 00:21:47,770
supposedly the Russians faked the

476
00:21:53,400 --> 00:21:50,380
Roswell events as a means to sort of

477
00:21:56,700 --> 00:21:53,410
create hysteria in the US no it's a very

478
00:21:59,010 --> 00:21:56,710
bizarre an extremely controversial story

479
00:22:02,100 --> 00:21:59,020
and he comes from a a woman named Annie

480
00:22:05,360 --> 00:22:02,110
Jacobson who wrote a book on area 51 and

481
00:22:07,770 --> 00:22:05,370
various other books and and also unlike

482
00:22:10,170 --> 00:22:07,780
Operation Paperclip when they bought the

483
00:22:13,380 --> 00:22:10,180
German scientist over at the set of end

484
00:22:15,120 --> 00:22:13,390
of the second world war and her area 51

485
00:22:17,100 --> 00:22:15,130
books that's a really good book I'm it's

486
00:22:19,310 --> 00:22:17,110
a really thick book you know a long book

487
00:22:22,500 --> 00:22:19,320
and it's filled with a lot of

488
00:22:26,250 --> 00:22:22,510
fascinating secret material on area 51

489
00:22:28,320 --> 00:22:26,260
but it concerned contains this bizarre

490
00:22:32,400 --> 00:22:28,330
story of house

491
00:22:35,190 --> 00:22:32,410
Joseph Stalin did a deal with Joseph

492
00:22:37,140 --> 00:22:35,200
Mengele who was one of the most deranged

493
00:22:39,420 --> 00:22:37,150
evil men who ever lived

494
00:22:42,660 --> 00:22:39,430
who did all these terrible experiments

495
00:22:46,260 --> 00:22:42,670
on people in this in the Second World

496
00:22:48,840 --> 00:22:46,270
War the story is that supposedly mangle

497
00:22:51,690 --> 00:22:48,850
a had the ability to take a number of

498
00:22:53,420 --> 00:22:51,700
children and physically alter them to

499
00:22:58,130 --> 00:22:53,430
make them look like what we would call

500
00:23:01,200 --> 00:22:58,140
aliens today as well as supposedly

501
00:23:04,110 --> 00:23:01,210
genetically or physically altering these

502
00:23:09,150 --> 00:23:04,120
children the the story is that the

503
00:23:12,210 --> 00:23:09,160
Porton brothers who were aviation people

504
00:23:15,000 --> 00:23:12,220
who designed a lot of futuristic looking

505
00:23:18,020 --> 00:23:15,010
aircraft supposedly they were brought in

506
00:23:21,720 --> 00:23:18,030
to design the craft and the plan

507
00:23:24,540 --> 00:23:21,730
allegedly was that this particular craft

508
00:23:28,290 --> 00:23:24,550
with his strange-looking kids inside

509
00:23:30,750 --> 00:23:28,300
would be remotely piloted from Russia to

510
00:23:33,780 --> 00:23:30,760
the United States and it was the story

511
00:23:37,890 --> 00:23:33,790
it was supposed to come down in like a

512
00:23:39,930 --> 00:23:37,900
highly populated part of the US but as

513
00:23:41,640 --> 00:23:39,940
it was going over New Mexico something

514
00:23:44,130 --> 00:23:41,650
went wrong it may have been a stall or

515
00:23:47,370 --> 00:23:44,140
lightning strike and it came down in

516
00:23:49,620 --> 00:23:47,380
Lincoln County New Mexico not too far

517
00:23:52,680 --> 00:23:49,630
from the town of Roswell about an hour's

518
00:23:55,020 --> 00:23:52,690
drive or so and so in other words the

519
00:23:58,500 --> 00:23:55,030
plan to have the aircraft come down

520
00:24:00,180 --> 00:23:58,510
these altered kids come out and then

521
00:24:02,220 --> 00:24:00,190
everybody would say oh my god the

522
00:24:04,140 --> 00:24:02,230
Martians are invading and it would sort

523
00:24:07,350 --> 00:24:04,150
of be like a parallel to the Orson

524
00:24:09,450 --> 00:24:07,360
Welles story of war the world you know

525
00:24:13,860 --> 00:24:09,460
when people who listen to awesome

526
00:24:16,380 --> 00:24:13,870
Wales's radio recording to this in 1939

527
00:24:18,630 --> 00:24:16,390
people who turn on the radio halfway

528
00:24:20,940 --> 00:24:18,640
through or whatever thought the Martians

529
00:24:22,980 --> 00:24:20,950
really were invaded they didn't realize

530
00:24:25,950 --> 00:24:22,990
it was a radio show so that was this

531
00:24:31,170 --> 00:24:25,960
supposedly inspiration for all this

532
00:24:33,900 --> 00:24:31,180
interest yeah now the the story gets

533
00:24:37,410 --> 00:24:33,910
sort of more controversial when if you

534
00:24:40,290 --> 00:24:37,420
look at it the idea of having one a

535
00:24:41,080 --> 00:24:40,300
futuristic aircraft being remotely

536
00:24:43,480 --> 00:24:41,090
flower

537
00:24:45,610 --> 00:24:43,490
from all the way from Russia buy another

538
00:24:48,310 --> 00:24:45,620
one I don't think that kind of

539
00:24:50,440 --> 00:24:48,320
technology was around then you know just

540
00:24:53,139 --> 00:24:50,450
just to strap four kids in a

541
00:24:56,169 --> 00:24:53,149
weird-looking aircraft and then remotely

542
00:25:00,460 --> 00:24:56,179
pile Italy all the way from Russia to

543
00:25:03,249 --> 00:25:00,470
the US now on top of that and this is

544
00:25:05,710 --> 00:25:03,259
actually in the book it talks about how

545
00:25:08,560 --> 00:25:05,720
they found Russian writing inside and

546
00:25:11,009 --> 00:25:08,570
that probably the stories you know that

547
00:25:16,180 --> 00:25:11,019
that inspired the the tales of like

548
00:25:20,080 --> 00:25:16,190
hieroglyphics on the yeah I mean but any

549
00:25:22,239 --> 00:25:20,090
kind of experts on you know Russian and

550
00:25:24,310 --> 00:25:22,249
Russian language would quickly say that

551
00:25:27,549 --> 00:25:24,320
it was Russian and the idea that the

552
00:25:31,480 --> 00:25:27,559
Russians you know were in cahoots with

553
00:25:33,249 --> 00:25:31,490
the aliens and I mean the idea that just

554
00:25:36,190 --> 00:25:33,259
that just the idea that they would put

555
00:25:38,379 --> 00:25:36,200
you know Russian right in in the craft

556
00:25:41,440 --> 00:25:38,389
makes no sense if you're trying to pull

557
00:25:44,440 --> 00:25:41,450
it off as being extraterrestrial that

558
00:25:48,519 --> 00:25:44,450
doesn't make much sense and so my view

559
00:25:50,830 --> 00:25:48,529
on all of this is that if you read any

560
00:25:52,810 --> 00:25:50,840
Jacobson's book it's a really good book

561
00:25:55,210 --> 00:25:52,820
and I would recommend it to everyone who

562
00:25:57,220 --> 00:25:55,220
wants to learn about area 51 it's not

563
00:26:00,669 --> 00:25:57,230
like a sensationalized book it's a good

564
00:26:04,330 --> 00:26:00,679
solid nonfiction book but it has this

565
00:26:08,049 --> 00:26:04,340
Roswell story inserted into it and I

566
00:26:10,419 --> 00:26:08,059
think possibly people out at area 51

567
00:26:12,159 --> 00:26:10,429
working there now thought well you know

568
00:26:14,019 --> 00:26:12,169
this book's got a lot of top-secret

569
00:26:17,470 --> 00:26:14,029
stuff you know that we don't want

570
00:26:21,509 --> 00:26:17,480
getting out how about we insert a really

571
00:26:23,919 --> 00:26:21,519
sensational story and have the press

572
00:26:26,190 --> 00:26:23,929
predominantly focusing on this

573
00:26:30,549 --> 00:26:26,200
controversial story about Roswell and

574
00:26:33,480 --> 00:26:30,559
the story that was about this you know

575
00:26:37,509 --> 00:26:33,490
this Russian Roswell thing was given to

576
00:26:40,690 --> 00:26:37,519
Annie Jacobson by a guy named Alfred

577
00:26:43,029 --> 00:26:40,700
O'Donnell it was he had ties to area 51

578
00:26:46,210 --> 00:26:43,039
and the military intelligence community

579
00:26:49,359 --> 00:26:46,220
and he provided that story now my view

580
00:26:51,279 --> 00:26:49,369
is that it was done deliberately to

581
00:26:53,930 --> 00:26:51,289
because it was such a sensationalized

582
00:26:58,159 --> 00:26:53,940
story I think the hope was

583
00:26:59,869 --> 00:26:58,169
that the media would forget most of the

584
00:27:02,600 --> 00:26:59,879
good stuff on area 51 that was in the

585
00:27:04,549 --> 00:27:02,610
book and focus on Roswell and for the

586
00:27:07,129 --> 00:27:04,559
mouse but that's what happened a lot of

587
00:27:10,700 --> 00:27:07,139
the be cut the coverage and publicity

588
00:27:12,980 --> 00:27:10,710
for the book focused on Roswell in this

589
00:27:16,639 --> 00:27:12,990
Russian story so I think it was designed

590
00:27:20,180 --> 00:27:16,649
to fear the book away in the media away

591
00:27:23,389 --> 00:27:20,190
from the legitimate real material record

592
00:27:25,570 --> 00:27:23,399
so II thought if there was any truth to

593
00:27:28,690 --> 00:27:25,580
it you know that would be like a

594
00:27:32,110 --> 00:27:28,700
psychological warfare manipulation

595
00:27:35,629 --> 00:27:32,120
involving a bogus story but also

596
00:27:37,999 --> 00:27:35,639
creating you know literally a craft and

597
00:27:41,869 --> 00:27:38,009
literally creating aliens in a very

598
00:27:44,840 --> 00:27:41,879
strange way yeah so I think but again

599
00:27:46,820 --> 00:27:44,850
that much of the story falls down so I

600
00:27:50,450 --> 00:27:46,830
actually think you know he really

601
00:27:53,659 --> 00:27:50,460
probably was a fabrication designed to

602
00:27:55,549 --> 00:27:53,669
as I said steer people away from what's

603
00:27:58,789 --> 00:27:55,559
what actually go on at area 51 and

604
00:28:01,249 --> 00:27:58,799
Ivan's getting all excited about this

605
00:28:03,259 --> 00:28:01,259
Russian story yeah and I'm sure from the

606
00:28:04,999 --> 00:28:03,269
Russians perspective they were probably

607
00:28:07,249 --> 00:28:05,009
quite happy and they probably still are

608
00:28:09,919 --> 00:28:07,259
to have people think or some people

609
00:28:12,740 --> 00:28:09,929
think that they were responsible for

610
00:28:14,720 --> 00:28:12,750
Roswell you know it kind of beefs up

611
00:28:17,029 --> 00:28:14,730
their image from the absolute from their

612
00:28:20,240 --> 00:28:17,039
perspective you know right you know and

613
00:28:23,060 --> 00:28:20,250
you know you take for instance you know

614
00:28:26,570 --> 00:28:23,070
I'm not comparing all of Russia to

615
00:28:28,430 --> 00:28:26,580
terrorists I'm not no America say

616
00:28:30,169 --> 00:28:28,440
something like that but you know a

617
00:28:33,470 --> 00:28:30,179
terrorist group will take any

618
00:28:35,450 --> 00:28:33,480
opportunity to take the the

619
00:28:40,070 --> 00:28:35,460
responsibility for something you know

620
00:28:42,470 --> 00:28:40,080
say so some pissed-off kid and in

621
00:28:44,330 --> 00:28:42,480
America does a pipe bomb in the middle

622
00:28:45,919 --> 00:28:44,340
of Times Square in New York of course

623
00:28:47,779 --> 00:28:45,929
some terrorist group is gonna say we

624
00:28:49,789 --> 00:28:47,789
were responsible in that you know and it

625
00:28:53,119 --> 00:28:49,799
can just that's idea of psychological

626
00:28:54,909 --> 00:28:53,129
warfare and in fear so of course the

627
00:28:57,690 --> 00:28:54,919
Russians are gonna say yeah we totally

628
00:29:01,500 --> 00:28:57,700
concocted this genius plan

629
00:29:03,060 --> 00:29:01,510
and changed ufology or not just ufology

630
00:29:05,490 --> 00:29:03,070
national security in the united states

631
00:29:08,519 --> 00:29:05,500
forever yeah you're right and I mean one

632
00:29:09,960 --> 00:29:08,529
of the things about ufology and what

633
00:29:13,740 --> 00:29:09,970
I've found over the years and the

634
00:29:16,669 --> 00:29:13,750
decades is that a lot of people in the

635
00:29:19,409 --> 00:29:16,679
field are very susceptible to

636
00:29:22,230 --> 00:29:19,419
sensational stories and with leaked

637
00:29:24,600 --> 00:29:22,240
documents things like that and so many

638
00:29:26,460 --> 00:29:24,610
people you know view these documents is

639
00:29:29,519 --> 00:29:26,470
real because he's got a top-secret stamp

640
00:29:30,960 --> 00:29:29,529
and the story sounds really cool and my

641
00:29:33,180 --> 00:29:30,970
view is well how do you actually know

642
00:29:34,889 --> 00:29:33,190
this is real just because it's a photo

643
00:29:37,649 --> 00:29:34,899
I'm it's a photocopy probably for the

644
00:29:40,259 --> 00:29:37,659
most part and just because somebody got

645
00:29:43,289 --> 00:29:40,269
their hands on a 1950s typewriter put a

646
00:29:45,450 --> 00:29:43,299
stamp on doesn't mean it's real it just

647
00:29:48,269 --> 00:29:45,460
means somebody has gone to a fairly good

648
00:29:49,259 --> 00:29:48,279
length to try and make something look

649
00:29:51,360 --> 00:29:49,269
like the real deal

650
00:29:53,549 --> 00:29:51,370
right but the problem is with in you

651
00:29:55,590 --> 00:29:53,559
follow gee so many people want these

652
00:29:57,419 --> 00:29:55,600
documents to be real I know they do

653
00:29:59,129 --> 00:29:57,429
because when people get disappointed

654
00:30:02,159 --> 00:29:59,139
about it Dayna

655
00:30:03,629 --> 00:30:02,169
a fake UFO documents they're

656
00:30:04,740 --> 00:30:03,639
disappointed by it that means they

657
00:30:05,700 --> 00:30:04,750
wanted it to be real

658
00:30:07,980 --> 00:30:05,710
oh yeah cause you're not going to get

659
00:30:09,000 --> 00:30:07,990
disappointed if you're just Lars I about

660
00:30:13,500 --> 00:30:09,010
it all over all right

661
00:30:16,200 --> 00:30:13,510
so and that and that is a good pointer

662
00:30:21,480 --> 00:30:16,210
because it demonstrates how easy it is

663
00:30:24,360 --> 00:30:21,490
to manipulate UFO people because the

664
00:30:28,919 --> 00:30:24,370
whole x-files I want to believe factor

665
00:30:31,590 --> 00:30:28,929
just plays into it all and and we all

666
00:30:34,680 --> 00:30:31,600
get you know questionable stuff known

667
00:30:36,810 --> 00:30:34,690
again and mysterious characters you know

668
00:30:39,240 --> 00:30:36,820
want to speak to you and I always tell

669
00:30:42,899 --> 00:30:39,250
people when you follow it but don't go

670
00:30:45,090 --> 00:30:42,909
into it with your head thinking okay

671
00:30:47,220 --> 00:30:45,100
this is the real deal just see where he

672
00:30:49,019 --> 00:30:47,230
goes maybe there's the real deal maybe

673
00:30:50,850 --> 00:30:49,029
it's gonna turn out to be garbage maybe

674
00:30:55,049 --> 00:30:50,860
it's gonna be hazy somewhere between the

675
00:30:59,279 --> 00:30:55,059
two and then reveal your results but

676
00:31:02,580 --> 00:30:59,289
don't get overly excited just because

677
00:31:05,220 --> 00:31:02,590
somebody says they once walked worked on

678
00:31:06,930 --> 00:31:05,230
an alien autopsy maybe they did but then

679
00:31:08,250 --> 00:31:06,940
it's taking all excited and telling

680
00:31:09,460 --> 00:31:08,260
everybody before you've done the

681
00:31:11,340 --> 00:31:09,470
investigation

682
00:31:14,170 --> 00:31:11,350
get them to take the whole story

683
00:31:15,820 --> 00:31:14,180
research it will give me the name of the

684
00:31:18,340 --> 00:31:15,830
other doctors you know that kind of

685
00:31:23,440 --> 00:31:18,350
thing and I think that's sometimes the

686
00:31:26,530 --> 00:31:23,450
problem ufology is so easily to mold and

687
00:31:28,870 --> 00:31:26,540
manipulate because so often people in

688
00:31:31,750 --> 00:31:28,880
the field jump the gun and I put a story

689
00:31:34,510 --> 00:31:31,760
out before it's finished researched and

690
00:31:36,040 --> 00:31:34,520
everybody then jumps onto it and you've

691
00:31:38,890 --> 00:31:36,050
got the hoax as who said oh yeah I

692
00:31:40,720 --> 00:31:38,900
worked on that program as well and then

693
00:31:44,380 --> 00:31:40,730
but then no one else had talked about it

694
00:31:46,590 --> 00:31:44,390
so you come out with it you know then I

695
00:31:48,610 --> 00:31:46,600
think one of the things that really

696
00:31:50,980 --> 00:31:48,620
stuck out to me you and I were

697
00:31:53,380 --> 00:31:50,990
discussing this yesterday when UFO

698
00:31:55,360 --> 00:31:53,390
researchers we've we've all been there

699
00:31:57,430 --> 00:31:55,370
someone approaches you and says I've got

700
00:31:59,410 --> 00:31:57,440
this groundbreaking information that I

701
00:32:01,900 --> 00:31:59,420
want to share with you and only you and

702
00:32:04,270 --> 00:32:01,910
you brought up something that I'd never

703
00:32:06,430 --> 00:32:04,280
really thought about either is not so

704
00:32:08,080 --> 00:32:06,440
much who is this person what is the

705
00:32:10,090 --> 00:32:08,090
information they're giving you but why

706
00:32:11,740 --> 00:32:10,100
why are they coming to you not

707
00:32:14,500 --> 00:32:11,750
specifically and I found that really

708
00:32:16,150 --> 00:32:14,510
interesting yeah I mean I think it's

709
00:32:18,550 --> 00:32:16,160
important to sort of look at the bigger

710
00:32:21,400 --> 00:32:18,560
picture of things you know the why and

711
00:32:23,620 --> 00:32:21,410
when of how you got this story and I

712
00:32:25,090 --> 00:32:23,630
mean I would say to people well is there

713
00:32:29,620 --> 00:32:25,100
anything else that you're looking into

714
00:32:31,320 --> 00:32:29,630
at this particular time and you know

715
00:32:34,680 --> 00:32:31,330
maybe the person was looking into

716
00:32:37,360 --> 00:32:34,690
visited hypothetical now but you know

717
00:32:39,880 --> 00:32:37,370
somebody's looking into the history of

718
00:32:42,460 --> 00:32:39,890
atomic energy in the US and then some of

719
00:32:44,230 --> 00:32:42,470
the old guy comes along hey I've heard

720
00:32:46,690 --> 00:32:44,240
about you be doing this research I can

721
00:32:50,620 --> 00:32:46,700
help you but that old person may

722
00:32:52,870 --> 00:32:50,630
actually be inserted to actually find

723
00:32:55,810 --> 00:32:52,880
out well why is this person looking into

724
00:32:58,240 --> 00:32:55,820
this whole story you know of atomic

725
00:33:01,510 --> 00:32:58,250
energy history in the u.s. right so

726
00:33:03,670 --> 00:33:01,520
sometimes you know the again the UFO

727
00:33:05,590 --> 00:33:03,680
subject can be used like that if

728
00:33:09,400 --> 00:33:05,600
somebody thinks you're doing something

729
00:33:11,020 --> 00:33:09,410
else yeah well let stays them and you

730
00:33:13,000 --> 00:33:11,030
know we'll we'll learn what they

731
00:33:14,620 --> 00:33:13,010
actually really are doing well at the

732
00:33:17,409 --> 00:33:14,630
dangly carrots you know give me

733
00:33:19,719 --> 00:33:17,419
something then yeah yeah

734
00:33:22,509 --> 00:33:19,729
you have all these stories of you know

735
00:33:25,419 --> 00:33:22,519
the Paul bennewitz is and the you know

736
00:33:27,609 --> 00:33:25,429
using people I'll see how the public

737
00:33:29,499 --> 00:33:27,619
will react a lot of people think the

738
00:33:31,779 --> 00:33:29,509
stories of Bob Lazar were another

739
00:33:34,029 --> 00:33:31,789
attempt to you know throw a couple

740
00:33:36,219 --> 00:33:34,039
carrots out there see how people are yet

741
00:33:39,339 --> 00:33:36,229
to the information well I mean you know

742
00:33:41,739 --> 00:33:39,349
I'm the issue of Bob Lazar I mean 30

743
00:33:44,349 --> 00:33:41,749
years well more than 30 years 31 32

744
00:33:46,889 --> 00:33:44,359
years now since he he came out and

745
00:33:49,810 --> 00:33:46,899
talked about all this I mean it's still

746
00:33:52,089 --> 00:33:49,820
debated you know it's it hasn't done

747
00:33:56,019 --> 00:33:52,099
away regardless of whether you buy into

748
00:34:00,009 --> 00:33:56,029
it or don't but again I mean for me I

749
00:34:02,889 --> 00:34:00,019
think whatever the reason was that that

750
00:34:07,259 --> 00:34:02,899
whole plan if you like the whole program

751
00:34:10,839 --> 00:34:07,269
was was initiated to achieve the the

752
00:34:14,710 --> 00:34:10,849
endgame that he has achieved now why it

753
00:34:17,919 --> 00:34:14,720
was done I don't know now I don't

754
00:34:21,039 --> 00:34:17,929
believe Lazar was a liar like you know

755
00:34:23,289 --> 00:34:21,049
there are people in ufology who do think

756
00:34:25,930 --> 00:34:23,299
he's just an outright liar I member Stan

757
00:34:27,190 --> 00:34:25,940
Freeman famously said this is a bonk

758
00:34:29,700 --> 00:34:27,200
bonk bonk

759
00:34:32,169 --> 00:34:29,710
he said he three times like this is

760
00:34:36,519 --> 00:34:32,179
bong-bong-bong and he had no time for

761
00:34:38,859 --> 00:34:36,529
bob lazar at all but to me Lazar doesn't

762
00:34:41,409 --> 00:34:38,869
come across like your average hoaxer you

763
00:34:43,359 --> 00:34:41,419
know I mean you think about it's 88 when

764
00:34:46,450 --> 00:34:43,369
he came out under an alias when started

765
00:34:51,659 --> 00:34:46,460
in with a radio 89 we got his name and

766
00:34:53,950 --> 00:34:51,669
now you know it's almost 2020 and if

767
00:34:57,309 --> 00:34:53,960
although he's bought autobiographies

768
00:34:58,539 --> 00:34:57,319
coming out very soon the fact is pretty

769
00:35:00,759 --> 00:34:58,549
much up until the last couple of years

770
00:35:03,039 --> 00:35:00,769
he didn't do anything with that story he

771
00:35:05,069 --> 00:35:03,049
told people this is what happened like

772
00:35:10,809 --> 00:35:05,079
it or not and if you don't like it

773
00:35:15,190 --> 00:35:10,819
whatever you know and so you know he did

774
00:35:18,460 --> 00:35:15,200
at that time 88 89 90 when he was like

775
00:35:20,650 --> 00:35:18,470
really huge he didn't write a book he

776
00:35:22,450 --> 00:35:20,660
didn't have a movie he did a few

777
00:35:28,010 --> 00:35:22,460
lectures but he wasn't like someone who

778
00:35:30,710 --> 00:35:28,020
was on like a 70 city tour of the US

779
00:35:33,320 --> 00:35:30,720
very underground yeah no that that isn't

780
00:35:35,020 --> 00:35:33,330
really how the average hoaxer comes

781
00:35:36,920 --> 00:35:35,030
across in ufology I mean I've met

782
00:35:40,280 --> 00:35:36,930
unfortunately you know more than a few

783
00:35:43,700 --> 00:35:40,290
hoaxes out of the years and you know

784
00:35:47,690 --> 00:35:43,710
money comes up almost immediately a lot

785
00:35:51,230 --> 00:35:47,700
of stuff that can't be proved and when

786
00:35:53,060 --> 00:35:51,240
the initial core story sort of goes

787
00:35:55,370 --> 00:35:53,070
quiet after they finished their lecture

788
00:35:56,810 --> 00:35:55,380
circuit thing for three months then they

789
00:35:59,210 --> 00:35:56,820
say oh you know I've had some more

790
00:36:01,820 --> 00:35:59,220
experiences so they can get back on the

791
00:36:05,660 --> 00:36:01,830
lecture circuit you know that's how so

792
00:36:09,740 --> 00:36:05,670
many ufologists excuse me UFO witnesses

793
00:36:12,140 --> 00:36:09,750
I mean who may have fabricated something

794
00:36:14,090 --> 00:36:12,150
that's how they work but Lazar didn't

795
00:36:16,730 --> 00:36:14,100
were like that it really was well I've

796
00:36:18,350 --> 00:36:16,740
told my I've told you my story if you

797
00:36:21,650 --> 00:36:18,360
don't like it and you don't believe me

798
00:36:25,970 --> 00:36:21,660
there's the front door you know and and

799
00:36:29,120 --> 00:36:25,980
that's not how most hoaxes of works and

800
00:36:33,620 --> 00:36:29,130
and I mean if he was a hoaxer in that

801
00:36:37,310 --> 00:36:33,630
period 89 90 he could have you know sort

802
00:36:41,420 --> 00:36:37,320
of dominated ufology for years lectures

803
00:36:45,050 --> 00:36:41,430
conferences TV shows movies the whole

804
00:36:49,490 --> 00:36:45,060
thing and I don't see what he gained

805
00:36:51,230 --> 00:36:49,500
back then for doing that because he

806
00:36:53,720 --> 00:36:51,240
didn't really gain anything other than

807
00:36:57,860 --> 00:36:53,730
notoriety and people saying you full of

808
00:37:01,160 --> 00:36:57,870
crap you know so so that's why I think

809
00:37:04,730 --> 00:37:01,170
he was part of it but he was like an

810
00:37:07,630 --> 00:37:04,740
innocent Patsy who used as a means to

811
00:37:11,570 --> 00:37:07,640
for whatever reason I think somebody

812
00:37:14,300 --> 00:37:11,580
probably in area 51 wanted to get the

813
00:37:15,140 --> 00:37:14,310
story out that yes there are aliens at

814
00:37:19,280 --> 00:37:15,150
area 51

815
00:37:22,310 --> 00:37:19,290
now why somebody might do that that's a

816
00:37:25,040 --> 00:37:22,320
big question I think the the possibility

817
00:37:27,470 --> 00:37:25,050
could have been you know and this is

818
00:37:29,720 --> 00:37:27,480
hypothetical but maybe if there were

819
00:37:32,660 --> 00:37:29,730
sort of fears that there were Russian

820
00:37:34,940 --> 00:37:32,670
agents in the US and looking into our

821
00:37:37,610 --> 00:37:34,950
defense systems and you know pretending

822
00:37:39,800 --> 00:37:37,620
to be tourists that kind of thing well

823
00:37:41,480 --> 00:37:39,810
if you put a story out this there's

824
00:37:41,839 --> 00:37:41,490
something really weird and sensational

825
00:37:45,650 --> 00:37:41,849
go

826
00:37:48,439 --> 00:37:45,660
today 51 and they get someone involved

827
00:37:52,279 --> 00:37:48,449
who can essentially vindicate it like

828
00:37:54,650 --> 00:37:52,289
Lazar and and you've got all these

829
00:37:56,900 --> 00:37:54,660
Russian spies you know looking into it

830
00:37:58,759 --> 00:37:56,910
and because it's so sensational

831
00:38:00,380 --> 00:37:58,769
there's no way they're not going to

832
00:38:02,779 --> 00:38:00,390
invest the Russians aren't going to look

833
00:38:04,400 --> 00:38:02,789
into it well maybe that's like just like

834
00:38:07,130 --> 00:38:04,410
you know the fishermen reeling in the

835
00:38:08,930 --> 00:38:07,140
fish but US intelligence reels in the

836
00:38:11,029 --> 00:38:08,940
Russian spies because they're all

837
00:38:12,849 --> 00:38:11,039
hovering around area 51 because they've

838
00:38:15,229 --> 00:38:12,859
heard all these stories about

839
00:38:18,259 --> 00:38:15,239
sensational alien technology and weapons

840
00:38:20,150 --> 00:38:18,269
and oh my god the Americans have got

841
00:38:22,489 --> 00:38:20,160
this and we haven't we need to find out

842
00:38:25,009 --> 00:38:22,499
what's going on and if I recall weren't

843
00:38:28,189 --> 00:38:25,019
some of our first images ever of area 51

844
00:38:29,900 --> 00:38:28,199
from Russian yeah satellites yeah Wow

845
00:38:32,509 --> 00:38:29,910
so the Russians knew something was going

846
00:38:34,430 --> 00:38:32,519
on yeah yeah and if they were trying to

847
00:38:36,680 --> 00:38:34,440
find out more and more somebody in the

848
00:38:40,009 --> 00:38:36,690
area 51 might have said well let's give

849
00:38:42,289 --> 00:38:40,019
him the ultimate fish in the river you

850
00:38:44,420 --> 00:38:42,299
know and Jim Bell they'll catch it yeah

851
00:38:47,449 --> 00:38:44,430
and then we'll catch them isn't it funny

852
00:38:49,459 --> 00:38:47,459
it's let's say for just a moment that

853
00:38:51,259 --> 00:38:49,469
the Russians were responsible for

854
00:38:54,140 --> 00:38:51,269
Roswell and whatever happened there

855
00:38:57,920 --> 00:38:54,150
crash whatever was involved with that

856
00:39:00,140 --> 00:38:57,930
was brought to area 51 and now in return

857
00:39:02,959 --> 00:39:00,150
of them trying to create a hysteria in

858
00:39:05,329 --> 00:39:02,969
America now we're creating a hysteria

859
00:39:08,359 --> 00:39:05,339
for Russia thinking we have the same

860
00:39:11,660 --> 00:39:08,369
technology yeah nothing I think so many

861
00:39:14,719 --> 00:39:11,670
people in ufology don't recognize those

862
00:39:16,849 --> 00:39:14,729
weird sides to the phenomenon or the

863
00:39:19,249 --> 00:39:16,859
subject you know they think it's it's

864
00:39:22,849 --> 00:39:19,259
black and white it's aliens it's

865
00:39:25,759 --> 00:39:22,859
government cover-ups and and and that is

866
00:39:29,930 --> 00:39:25,769
you know that is a major part of it but

867
00:39:33,499 --> 00:39:29,940
so many people don't recognize the the

868
00:39:35,749 --> 00:39:33,509
full nature and the scope of how the

869
00:39:40,459 --> 00:39:35,759
subject and the people in it can be so

870
00:39:43,069 --> 00:39:40,469
easily manipulated and sent down this

871
00:39:44,449 --> 00:39:43,079
path and that path not even realizing

872
00:39:48,680 --> 00:39:44,459
that somebody's pulling their strings

873
00:39:51,380 --> 00:39:48,690
and all they see is the excitement

874
00:39:54,950 --> 00:39:51,390
factor and it is exciting but you can't

875
00:39:57,650 --> 00:39:54,960
just focus on that factor you've got a

876
00:40:00,589 --> 00:39:57,660
you know a tackle every aspect of

877
00:40:03,109 --> 00:40:00,599
whatever it is you do right right well I

878
00:40:05,240 --> 00:40:03,119
knew I knew we can connect area 51 to

879
00:40:08,029 --> 00:40:05,250
Russia so glad we found our way around

880
00:40:10,480 --> 00:40:08,039
that one um sort of wrapping up that

881
00:40:14,480 --> 00:40:10,490
this part of it Nick like the history of

882
00:40:16,430 --> 00:40:14,490
Russia and and even America influencing

883
00:40:18,589 --> 00:40:16,440
its own people and when it comes to the

884
00:40:21,769 --> 00:40:18,599
UFO topic you brought up something in

885
00:40:23,359 --> 00:40:21,779
the book this strategy to defuse the UFO

886
00:40:26,240 --> 00:40:23,369
hysteria using the Walt Disney

887
00:40:28,160 --> 00:40:26,250
Corporation oh yeah that was a really

888
00:40:29,779 --> 00:40:28,170
interesting part of the apology that a

889
00:40:31,760 --> 00:40:29,789
lot of people don't really know about

890
00:40:33,650 --> 00:40:31,770
could you maybe sort of wrapping this

891
00:40:37,240 --> 00:40:33,660
section up talking yeah that a little

892
00:40:40,160 --> 00:40:37,250
bit yeah I mean both sides recognize the

893
00:40:43,640 --> 00:40:40,170
the way in which the UFO subject could

894
00:40:46,220 --> 00:40:43,650
be manipulated as a means to alter

895
00:40:49,400 --> 00:40:46,230
people's views on just about anything

896
00:40:52,220 --> 00:40:49,410
really but the the Robertson panel was

897
00:40:56,390 --> 00:40:52,230
this prestigious panel set up in the

898
00:40:59,420 --> 00:40:56,400
early 1950s essentially - not so much

899
00:41:02,690 --> 00:40:59,430
investigate UFOs as sightings and

900
00:41:05,089 --> 00:41:02,700
encounters but have predominantly the

901
00:41:08,630 --> 00:41:05,099
phenomenon could be used from

902
00:41:11,329 --> 00:41:08,640
psychological perspectives and one of

903
00:41:13,099 --> 00:41:11,339
the fears was that the you know the

904
00:41:16,460 --> 00:41:13,109
Russians would use psychological warfare

905
00:41:19,299 --> 00:41:16,470
and so the plan with the Robertson panel

906
00:41:22,069 --> 00:41:19,309
was to sort of try and defuse the

907
00:41:24,849 --> 00:41:22,079
hysteria and the mania and the interest

908
00:41:28,069 --> 00:41:24,859
that was developing in terms of UFOs and

909
00:41:30,680 --> 00:41:28,079
they had a lot of strange plans one of

910
00:41:32,990 --> 00:41:30,690
them was to sort of enlist the help of

911
00:41:36,470 --> 00:41:33,000
the Walt Disney Corporation and have

912
00:41:38,750 --> 00:41:36,480
them make sort of little movies kind of

913
00:41:42,200 --> 00:41:38,760
you know putting it in like a

914
00:41:44,029 --> 00:41:42,210
tongue-in-cheek perspective but also you

915
00:41:46,010 --> 00:41:44,039
know making the point that well there's

916
00:41:48,109 --> 00:41:46,020
not much to this really at all it's just

917
00:41:52,250 --> 00:41:48,119
a bit of entertainments and people like

918
00:41:54,680 --> 00:41:52,260
it and you know pop culture and diffuse

919
00:41:56,839 --> 00:41:54,690
the idea that's you know there are

920
00:41:59,120 --> 00:41:56,849
Russia or that they're a communist

921
00:42:01,519 --> 00:41:59,130
aliens coming or that there are just

922
00:42:05,240 --> 00:42:01,529
aliens coming period you know that the

923
00:42:07,420 --> 00:42:05,250
idea was to just try and lay this all to

924
00:42:09,010 --> 00:42:07,430
rest and people will just go back to

925
00:42:13,180 --> 00:42:09,020
you know their regular lives before

926
00:42:15,670 --> 00:42:13,190
Flying Saucer surfaced in 1947 but again

927
00:42:18,430 --> 00:42:15,680
that the Robertson panel very quickly

928
00:42:21,609 --> 00:42:18,440
realized that you know just with a few

929
00:42:25,960 --> 00:42:21,619
tweaks and turns here and there you know

930
00:42:27,940 --> 00:42:25,970
they could actually alter the mindset to

931
00:42:30,670 --> 00:42:27,950
a degree and I mean if you think about

932
00:42:34,210 --> 00:42:30,680
it whether this was due to the Robertson

933
00:42:37,420 --> 00:42:34,220
panel or not but although the UFO

934
00:42:40,240 --> 00:42:37,430
subjects definitely obviously continued

935
00:42:43,480 --> 00:42:40,250
after 1953-54 when all this was going on

936
00:42:48,269 --> 00:42:43,490
but the political side of it we like the

937
00:42:50,470 --> 00:42:48,279
space brothers you know the contactees

938
00:42:54,279 --> 00:42:50,480
Adamski and the FBI watching all these

939
00:42:56,829 --> 00:42:54,289
people that really did go away after

940
00:42:59,650 --> 00:42:56,839
like the late 50's you know and it was

941
00:43:02,019 --> 00:42:59,660
all just about aliens and UFOs but if

942
00:43:04,029 --> 00:43:02,029
you go back to that fifties period it

943
00:43:07,180 --> 00:43:04,039
was filled with politics and just when

944
00:43:09,819 --> 00:43:07,190
all the contactees had files open on him

945
00:43:14,010 --> 00:43:09,829
you know George George Van Tassel's file

946
00:43:18,190 --> 00:43:14,020
who created the integratron yeah and

947
00:43:21,599 --> 00:43:18,200
lived out a giant rock his files his FBI

948
00:43:25,870 --> 00:43:21,609
files more than 400 pages gray Barker

949
00:43:28,510 --> 00:43:25,880
he's was about 75 pages George hunt

950
00:43:31,839 --> 00:43:28,520
Williamson he's about 65 pages and it

951
00:43:36,279 --> 00:43:31,849
goes on and on so there was this period

952
00:43:38,529 --> 00:43:36,289
for sure from 47 to about 59 58 that

953
00:43:41,740 --> 00:43:38,539
politics and the Russians and all this

954
00:43:46,089 --> 00:43:41,750
stuff you know was was going on and then

955
00:43:49,269 --> 00:43:46,099
to a large degree in terms of the FBI

956
00:43:51,309 --> 00:43:49,279
angle and the Russian angle went away so

957
00:43:53,970 --> 00:43:51,319
you know you could make a case that part

958
00:43:56,349 --> 00:43:53,980
of it that may have been influenced by

959
00:43:58,390 --> 00:43:56,359
you know people like the Russian and

960
00:44:01,599 --> 00:43:58,400
it's giving me like the the Robertson

961
00:44:04,029 --> 00:44:01,609
panel but you know it obviously didn't

962
00:44:06,700 --> 00:44:04,039
take away the UFO subjects right it just

963
00:44:07,359 --> 00:44:06,710
meant politics largely went out of it

964
00:44:09,700 --> 00:44:07,369
yeah

965
00:44:12,010 --> 00:44:09,710
but although the politics side went out

966
00:44:13,960 --> 00:44:12,020
of its you know the disinformation and

967
00:44:16,750 --> 00:44:13,970
the counterintelligence programs against

968
00:44:19,809 --> 00:44:16,760
the Russians that didn't go away but the

969
00:44:21,040 --> 00:44:19,819
you know the idea of people talking to

970
00:44:23,530 --> 00:44:21,050
communists alien

971
00:44:26,920 --> 00:44:23,540
that did kind of you know sort of go

972
00:44:30,040 --> 00:44:26,930
away so turn of the sixties thereabouts

973
00:44:34,210 --> 00:44:30,050
okay yeah it's it's fascinating to think

974
00:44:36,610 --> 00:44:34,220
of how you can use the UFO topic to mold

975
00:44:38,680 --> 00:44:36,620
and manipulate a certain narrative you

976
00:44:40,750 --> 00:44:38,690
could look at it now with this whole to

977
00:44:42,010 --> 00:44:40,760
the Stars Academy thing you know they

978
00:44:44,590 --> 00:44:42,020
they've got all these former

979
00:44:47,410 --> 00:44:44,600
intelligence officers counterterrorism

980
00:44:50,350 --> 00:44:47,420
people military people telling the

981
00:44:52,840 --> 00:44:50,360
public these things are being seen by

982
00:44:55,300 --> 00:44:52,850
our military our Navy our Air Force and

983
00:44:57,940 --> 00:44:55,310
they they pose a national security

984
00:45:00,550 --> 00:44:57,950
threat and so right now you've got the

985
00:45:03,520 --> 00:45:00,560
most visible UFO group out there to the

986
00:45:06,360 --> 00:45:03,530
Stars Academy hitting every major media

987
00:45:08,980 --> 00:45:06,370
news outlet reaching the biggest public

988
00:45:11,590 --> 00:45:08,990
platform we've really had in the UFO

989
00:45:13,930 --> 00:45:11,600
field for a while saying these things

990
00:45:16,540 --> 00:45:13,940
are dangerous and we need our military

991
00:45:18,460 --> 00:45:16,550
to take care of them in that boom I'm

992
00:45:20,650 --> 00:45:18,470
sure our military budgets are just

993
00:45:23,530 --> 00:45:20,660
skyrocketing well yeah I mean that's a

994
00:45:25,480 --> 00:45:23,540
good point because I think you know if

995
00:45:27,070 --> 00:45:25,490
you look at the history of ufology in

996
00:45:29,130 --> 00:45:27,080
terms of the government US government

997
00:45:31,870 --> 00:45:29,140
yeah project sign project Drudge

998
00:45:34,360 --> 00:45:31,880
Robertson panel and Blue Book and you

999
00:45:36,640 --> 00:45:34,370
know we were told that after 69 it was

1000
00:45:38,080 --> 00:45:36,650
all canned you know it was all over when

1001
00:45:42,550 --> 00:45:38,090
act and we learned you know the end of

1002
00:45:45,790 --> 00:45:42,560
2017 it wasn't over and I think why that

1003
00:45:48,430 --> 00:45:45,800
whole time frame like 2017 early 2018

1004
00:45:50,320 --> 00:45:48,440
was important was because you know the

1005
00:45:51,820 --> 00:45:50,330
debunkers skeptics said well the

1006
00:45:54,210 --> 00:45:51,830
government's not involved in ufology

1007
00:45:57,700 --> 00:45:54,220
anymore but he actually was you know and

1008
00:46:00,040 --> 00:45:57,710
I think well they I don't think I know

1009
00:46:03,340 --> 00:46:00,050
you know that the the mainstream media

1010
00:46:05,770 --> 00:46:03,350
you New York Times CNN everybody covered

1011
00:46:08,050 --> 00:46:05,780
this story and they still cover it now

1012
00:46:12,460 --> 00:46:08,060
when bits and pieces of no material

1013
00:46:14,800 --> 00:46:12,470
comes out so I think regardless of how

1014
00:46:17,020 --> 00:46:14,810
much research is going on with this

1015
00:46:20,020 --> 00:46:17,030
program I think another part of it is is

1016
00:46:23,020 --> 00:46:20,030
to see what the response is now not just

1017
00:46:25,390 --> 00:46:23,030
on the you know the five or six thousand

1018
00:46:29,380 --> 00:46:25,400
people in ufology but also the general

1019
00:46:32,290 --> 00:46:29,390
public and the media and say I see how

1020
00:46:33,800 --> 00:46:32,300
all three communities if you like

1021
00:46:36,320 --> 00:46:33,810
respond so

1022
00:46:39,320 --> 00:46:36,330
and so I think that's part of it it's

1023
00:46:42,970 --> 00:46:39,330
it's all I think it is legitimate in UFO

1024
00:46:47,800 --> 00:46:42,980
investigations but it's also like a

1025
00:46:50,690 --> 00:46:47,810
psychological study of the mindset of

1026
00:46:53,060 --> 00:46:50,700
what different people think about this

1027
00:46:54,920 --> 00:46:53,070
program and is it affecting them are

1028
00:46:57,650 --> 00:46:54,930
they thinking about it so there's

1029
00:47:00,440 --> 00:46:57,660
there's way more to it there's way more

1030
00:47:05,780 --> 00:47:00,450
to it I think and although I'm not a big

1031
00:47:08,180 --> 00:47:05,790
fan of disclosure mainly because it for

1032
00:47:10,130 --> 00:47:08,190
me it's almost like the the story of the

1033
00:47:12,470 --> 00:47:10,140
boy who cried wolf you know he cried too

1034
00:47:14,960 --> 00:47:12,480
many times and nobody came yeah and I

1035
00:47:17,930 --> 00:47:14,970
think that that's the main issue I have

1036
00:47:20,780 --> 00:47:17,940
with disclosure is not the the concept

1037
00:47:22,790 --> 00:47:20,790
of disclosure I got tired of here in

1038
00:47:25,670 --> 00:47:22,800
certain people conferences saying I've

1039
00:47:28,580 --> 00:47:25,680
got a high-ranking source who told me

1040
00:47:31,910 --> 00:47:28,590
you know that disclosures coming next

1041
00:47:34,490 --> 00:47:31,920
Thursday at 2:45 after whatever shows he

1042
00:47:36,410 --> 00:47:34,500
played out on the particular TV channel

1043
00:47:38,000 --> 00:47:36,420
I'm in a big sarcastic there you know

1044
00:47:40,190 --> 00:47:38,010
but I mean you get the point

1045
00:47:42,830 --> 00:47:40,200
people in the disclosure movement were

1046
00:47:44,480 --> 00:47:42,840
saying I've got got a contact and I

1047
00:47:46,640 --> 00:47:44,490
think it's coming out this year or it's

1048
00:47:49,160 --> 00:47:46,650
coming out later this year if not it's

1049
00:47:50,320 --> 00:47:49,170
the year after and that that's what sort

1050
00:47:53,210 --> 00:47:50,330
of pissed me off with the whole

1051
00:47:56,270 --> 00:47:53,220
disclosure movement I was like if you've

1052
00:47:58,940 --> 00:47:56,280
got nothing to say that's solid well go

1053
00:48:02,600 --> 00:47:58,950
away and come back when you're for sure

1054
00:48:05,690 --> 00:48:02,610
no the disclosures coming so that is my

1055
00:48:08,300 --> 00:48:05,700
issue now could disclosure happen well

1056
00:48:11,150 --> 00:48:08,310
it could but for me it's been smeared

1057
00:48:12,260 --> 00:48:11,160
with all these stories of yeah it's

1058
00:48:14,390 --> 00:48:12,270
coming next week that's coming next

1059
00:48:17,270 --> 00:48:14,400
month what's coming next year but in

1060
00:48:20,330 --> 00:48:17,280
saying that again I mean there could be

1061
00:48:22,550 --> 00:48:20,340
legitimate disclosure and we all finally

1062
00:48:26,140 --> 00:48:22,560
get the truth or it could be like a

1063
00:48:30,950 --> 00:48:26,150
fabricated manipulated disclosure where

1064
00:48:32,660 --> 00:48:30,960
for example you know people believe that

1065
00:48:34,460 --> 00:48:32,670
something has happened when he could

1066
00:48:36,340 --> 00:48:34,470
have been kind of like with the War of

1067
00:48:38,900 --> 00:48:36,350
the Worlds you know that was just a

1068
00:48:40,790 --> 00:48:38,910
entertainment but people bought into it

1069
00:48:43,850 --> 00:48:40,800
yeah you know I sometimes wonder if

1070
00:48:47,120 --> 00:48:43,860
disclosure might be like a fabricated

1071
00:48:49,850 --> 00:48:47,130
thing that would be a way to take away

1072
00:48:53,000 --> 00:48:49,860
more of our rights you know somebody

1073
00:48:56,030 --> 00:48:53,010
sees a fleet of UFOs over each city yeah

1074
00:48:58,730 --> 00:48:56,040
who's to say they were created on that

1075
00:49:01,970 --> 00:48:58,740
star system yeah maybe they were created

1076
00:49:04,100 --> 00:49:01,980
by us as a means to create fear you know

1077
00:49:07,670 --> 00:49:04,110
we all get up one morning and let's say

1078
00:49:11,660 --> 00:49:07,680
you know there's a 200 foot wide saucer

1079
00:49:13,730 --> 00:49:11,670
over 20 US cities I thought that's all

1080
00:49:16,850 --> 00:49:13,740
it would take to put the country in a

1081
00:49:21,830 --> 00:49:16,860
state of like what national security

1082
00:49:23,720 --> 00:49:21,840
issues would just saw you know I mean

1083
00:49:25,970 --> 00:49:23,730
some people might think that sounds like

1084
00:49:29,930 --> 00:49:25,980
really conspiratorial and paranoid which

1085
00:49:33,140 --> 00:49:29,940
led to a degree it is but you know it

1086
00:49:36,070 --> 00:49:33,150
would not take any time to you know

1087
00:49:37,910 --> 00:49:36,080
create a few sophisticated weird-looking

1088
00:49:40,610 --> 00:49:37,920
spaceship type things

1089
00:49:45,080 --> 00:49:40,620
I'll have him hover in each over a bunch

1090
00:49:47,480 --> 00:49:45,090
of cities and you know the city the

1091
00:49:50,390 --> 00:49:47,490
country being locked down within hours

1092
00:49:53,120 --> 00:49:50,400
yeah they really would that's so so

1093
00:49:55,790 --> 00:49:53,130
maybe disclosure you know and then you

1094
00:49:58,190 --> 00:49:55,800
know you've got some prominent figures

1095
00:49:59,630 --> 00:49:58,200
saying yes we aliens have finally

1096
00:50:01,190 --> 00:49:59,640
arrived I don't know what's going on

1097
00:50:04,640 --> 00:50:01,200
they're just sitting there in the sky

1098
00:50:07,280 --> 00:50:04,650
and we've got to do something about it

1099
00:50:09,410 --> 00:50:07,290
so we're gonna initiate new national

1100
00:50:10,880 --> 00:50:09,420
security laws because we don't know

1101
00:50:13,430 --> 00:50:10,890
what's going to happen yeah and before

1102
00:50:14,420 --> 00:50:13,440
you know it it's like you know more

1103
00:50:19,130 --> 00:50:14,430
rights are gone

1104
00:50:23,300 --> 00:50:19,140
great more so I doing nothing other than

1105
00:50:25,280 --> 00:50:23,310
fly a few craft in the sky which gets

1106
00:50:28,370 --> 00:50:25,290
everybody in a state of of whatever

1107
00:50:31,280 --> 00:50:28,380
mm-hmm it's really interesting the idea

1108
00:50:34,400 --> 00:50:31,290
of just the psychological warfare that's

1109
00:50:36,980 --> 00:50:34,410
been enacted probably on both ends in

1110
00:50:40,760 --> 00:50:36,990
either America or Russia and I think the

1111
00:50:42,560 --> 00:50:40,770
book sort of encapsulates this idea this

1112
00:50:48,830 --> 00:50:42,570
you bookend it so well in the beginning

1113
00:50:50,870 --> 00:50:48,840
and the end of going from one one time

1114
00:50:53,510 --> 00:50:50,880
in history when this could have happened

1115
00:50:55,109 --> 00:50:53,520
up until now where we have Russian

1116
00:50:56,910 --> 00:50:55,119
meddling happened happen

1117
00:50:59,849 --> 00:50:56,920
in our everyday elections here in

1118
00:51:02,130 --> 00:50:59,859
America so I I kind of want to ask you

1119
00:51:05,729 --> 00:51:02,140
closing this out Nick what is the

1120
00:51:10,259 --> 00:51:05,739
internet done in this new age to to

1121
00:51:12,989 --> 00:51:10,269
really show that it's so damn easy to

1122
00:51:15,930 --> 00:51:12,999
influence people there well one of the

1123
00:51:18,900 --> 00:51:15,940
problems is with the Internet is that I

1124
00:51:21,029 --> 00:51:18,910
think so many people just you know they

1125
00:51:24,569 --> 00:51:21,039
read the headline or the first couple of

1126
00:51:27,329 --> 00:51:24,579
paragraphs and you know it could be like

1127
00:51:31,799 --> 00:51:27,339
a multi-page article you know done by a

1128
00:51:33,779 --> 00:51:31,809
a reputable news outlets yeah but people

1129
00:51:35,219 --> 00:51:33,789
so I'm got time but they just read the

1130
00:51:38,219 --> 00:51:35,229
headline whatever and so they don't

1131
00:51:40,499 --> 00:51:38,229
sometimes that happens I think all the

1132
00:51:42,779 --> 00:51:40,509
time like yeah yeah I mean that does

1133
00:51:45,329 --> 00:51:42,789
happen and I think there's also this

1134
00:51:48,299 --> 00:51:45,339
tendency when people read in ufology

1135
00:51:51,930 --> 00:51:48,309
they reached up on the Internet I think

1136
00:51:56,009 --> 00:51:51,940
what's on the internet so it's real oh

1137
00:51:59,509 --> 00:51:56,019
yeah I mean it does and so you know I

1138
00:52:02,489 --> 00:51:59,519
think we need to be more careful and

1139
00:52:04,499 --> 00:52:02,499
tentative about what we say and when we

1140
00:52:06,479 --> 00:52:04,509
say it and that's like we thought you

1141
00:52:09,539 --> 00:52:06,489
know if I write a book like that one you

1142
00:52:11,579 --> 00:52:09,549
know that took about 18 months from

1143
00:52:14,609 --> 00:52:11,589
beginning to end to get all the Gator

1144
00:52:17,759 --> 00:52:14,619
research interview people and then to be

1145
00:52:20,729 --> 00:52:17,769
published and in that period I didn't

1146
00:52:23,430 --> 00:52:20,739
tell anyone about the book and I always

1147
00:52:25,559 --> 00:52:23,440
do that because something could happen

1148
00:52:27,329 --> 00:52:25,569
in that period that could blow one of

1149
00:52:29,249 --> 00:52:27,339
the cases completely the different

1150
00:52:32,339 --> 00:52:29,259
direction you know and I start talking

1151
00:52:34,650 --> 00:52:32,349
about it too soon you know then so

1152
00:52:36,450 --> 00:52:34,660
that's why I think it's important to do

1153
00:52:38,430 --> 00:52:36,460
all the research and stay as quiet as

1154
00:52:41,309 --> 00:52:38,440
you can and then when you've made a case

1155
00:52:44,630 --> 00:52:41,319
then put it out and I think if more

1156
00:52:48,289 --> 00:52:44,640
people did that we would have a

1157
00:52:51,089 --> 00:52:48,299
community that isn't unfortunately

1158
00:52:53,539 --> 00:52:51,099
infant when I infiltrated but filled

1159
00:52:57,359 --> 00:52:53,549
with you know controversial people

1160
00:52:59,969 --> 00:52:57,369
hoaxes somebody who we find out you know

1161
00:53:02,370 --> 00:52:59,979
spent five years in the slammer or

1162
00:53:04,589 --> 00:53:02,380
whatever for this yeah you know oh they

1163
00:53:06,390 --> 00:53:04,599
got a background in this and you know we

1164
00:53:08,359 --> 00:53:06,400
could have we could have died we could

1165
00:53:10,789 --> 00:53:08,369
have wrapped some of these people up

1166
00:53:13,849 --> 00:53:10,799
if somebody had instead of following

1167
00:53:16,969 --> 00:53:13,859
their story follow their background and

1168
00:53:19,729 --> 00:53:16,979
if it turns out to be legitimate that's

1169
00:53:21,559 --> 00:53:19,739
great if it turns out you know they were

1170
00:53:23,809 --> 00:53:21,569
busted for this and busted for that

1171
00:53:27,589 --> 00:53:23,819
there's a good chance their story's

1172
00:53:30,979 --> 00:53:27,599
bogus but you know we need to focus on

1173
00:53:33,410 --> 00:53:30,989
the alternative sides I think of the

1174
00:53:35,870 --> 00:53:33,420
theology to get some of the answers or

1175
00:53:38,299 --> 00:53:35,880
store why government agencies are

1176
00:53:40,999 --> 00:53:38,309
looking into things you know and and

1177
00:53:42,680 --> 00:53:41,009
it's not always for the reasons that it

1178
00:53:46,009 --> 00:53:42,690
isn't always because they're looking

1179
00:53:51,519 --> 00:53:46,019
into aliens yeah sometimes it's politics

1180
00:53:55,299 --> 00:53:51,529
it's mind manipulation of belief systems

1181
00:53:57,519 --> 00:53:55,309
and then it all comes into play and and

1182
00:54:01,579 --> 00:53:57,529
sometimes I think people just don't

1183
00:54:04,910 --> 00:54:01,589
realize the sheer depth that sometimes

1184
00:54:07,249 --> 00:54:04,920
that that sort of connection of

1185
00:54:10,719 --> 00:54:07,259
different things come to a connection

1186
00:54:13,870 --> 00:54:10,729
yeah it's and it's sort of fascinating

1187
00:54:17,829 --> 00:54:13,880
aspect that actually tells us more about

1188
00:54:21,469 --> 00:54:17,839
people and UFO and the UFO community

1189
00:54:24,170 --> 00:54:21,479
than it actually does the UFO phenomenon

1190
00:54:26,299 --> 00:54:24,180
itself okay yeah it's putting that

1191
00:54:28,160 --> 00:54:26,309
mirror back on ourselves oft and I think

1192
00:54:30,170 --> 00:54:28,170
that's that's a really good way to look

1193
00:54:32,630 --> 00:54:30,180
at it well can you tell us a little nick

1194
00:54:34,370 --> 00:54:32,640
about what what comes next for you and

1195
00:54:36,410 --> 00:54:34,380
where we can find all your work well

1196
00:54:38,839 --> 00:54:36,420
yeah the the new book flying saucers

1197
00:54:41,450 --> 00:54:38,849
from the Kremlin you can get that off

1198
00:54:43,190 --> 00:54:41,460
the shelves in Barnes & Noble or they

1199
00:54:47,089 --> 00:54:43,200
can order it in in a couple of days I

1200
00:54:48,529 --> 00:54:47,099
can get it from Amazon as well and the

1201
00:54:50,450 --> 00:54:48,539
next book I've got coming out is a

1202
00:54:53,259 --> 00:54:50,460
little bit of a departure it comes out

1203
00:54:55,969 --> 00:54:53,269
in April of next year and it's called

1204
00:54:59,269 --> 00:54:55,979
assassinations and it's a it's like a an

1205
00:55:01,009 --> 00:54:59,279
A to Z of historical assassinations

1206
00:55:03,529 --> 00:55:01,019
throughout history so actually goes back

1207
00:55:06,229 --> 00:55:03,539
to like the Egyptian times the Romans oh

1208
00:55:07,999 --> 00:55:06,239
wow yeah yeah and then through to you

1209
00:55:10,549 --> 00:55:08,009
know English kings and queens in the

1210
00:55:12,739 --> 00:55:10,559
Middle Ages and then through to like

1211
00:55:17,839 --> 00:55:12,749
Abraham Lincoln and then through the

1212
00:55:19,789 --> 00:55:17,849
course of 20th century of JFK RFK Martin

1213
00:55:22,700 --> 00:55:19,799
Luther King things like that so it's

1214
00:55:24,480 --> 00:55:22,710
there's about sort of 70 or

1215
00:55:26,309 --> 00:55:24,490
assassinations looked at and the

1216
00:55:28,230 --> 00:55:26,319
different theories who may have been

1217
00:55:31,410 --> 00:55:28,240
behind them and things like that

1218
00:55:33,630 --> 00:55:31,420
Oh interesting yes exactly some UFO

1219
00:55:35,630 --> 00:55:33,640
stuff in there people in ufology okay

1220
00:55:41,430 --> 00:55:35,640
who died under mysterious circumstances

1221
00:55:48,390 --> 00:55:41,440
and so it's full conspiracy stuff is it

1222
00:55:51,210 --> 00:55:48,400
sound all deaths is this a part of um

1223
00:55:52,470 --> 00:55:51,220
this series that you do because I know

1224
00:55:55,800 --> 00:55:52,480
you've done other books that are like

1225
00:55:59,010 --> 00:55:55,810
you know 50 cases of this yeah yeah yeah

1226
00:56:01,140 --> 00:55:59,020
it's done by visible impress and the

1227
00:56:03,359 --> 00:56:01,150
flying saucers from the cramming that's

1228
00:56:05,130 --> 00:56:03,369
just written in a regular style remember

1229
00:56:07,380 --> 00:56:05,140
visible ink press they have their own

1230
00:56:11,000 --> 00:56:07,390
way of doing all their books and they're

1231
00:56:13,500 --> 00:56:11,010
all 400 pages long 150,000 words and

1232
00:56:15,900 --> 00:56:13,510
sometimes they're done in a tizzy style

1233
00:56:17,520 --> 00:56:15,910
and sometimes it's chronological and

1234
00:56:19,079 --> 00:56:17,530
things like that yeah but then they're

1235
00:56:22,349 --> 00:56:19,089
sort of written from like a an

1236
00:56:25,290 --> 00:56:22,359
encyclopedia type perspective not where

1237
00:56:28,200 --> 00:56:25,300
it's like Dolan dusty to read you know

1238
00:56:30,359 --> 00:56:28,210
but it's the style is where you know you

1239
00:56:33,569 --> 00:56:30,369
could if you take to see you know you

1240
00:56:36,120 --> 00:56:33,579
can look up K for Kennedy Frank John F

1241
00:56:38,190 --> 00:56:36,130
you know and then you could jump back to

1242
00:56:40,200 --> 00:56:38,200
the start of the book for a room but

1243
00:56:41,819 --> 00:56:40,210
Julius Caesar that kind of thing so

1244
00:56:44,970 --> 00:56:41,829
you're not forced in other words to go

1245
00:56:47,730 --> 00:56:44,980
from page 1 to 400 which can be a bit

1246
00:56:50,130 --> 00:56:47,740
daunting daunting for me sometimes you

1247
00:56:51,780 --> 00:56:50,140
don't read in a huge a book it's like oh

1248
00:56:55,800 --> 00:56:51,790
my god I'm going to get through this you

1249
00:56:57,359 --> 00:56:55,810
know I think people like it when you

1250
00:56:59,160 --> 00:56:57,369
know just take the book to the beach or

1251
00:57:02,700 --> 00:56:59,170
whatever and take the Kindle to the

1252
00:57:04,140 --> 00:57:02,710
beach and I just dip into it here and

1253
00:57:06,480 --> 00:57:04,150
there you're not you know it's not like

1254
00:57:10,109 --> 00:57:06,490
you've got to keep going from page 1 to

1255
00:57:12,210 --> 00:57:10,119
400 I actually like that style me too I

1256
00:57:16,770 --> 00:57:12,220
mean I remember reading your book where

1257
00:57:18,930 --> 00:57:16,780
you recorded a UFO event from every day

1258
00:57:21,180 --> 00:57:18,940
of the week oh yeah here yeah and that

1259
00:57:22,710 --> 00:57:21,190
was so cool cuz you literally could wake

1260
00:57:24,540 --> 00:57:22,720
up every morning with their coffee and

1261
00:57:27,210 --> 00:57:24,550
what happened in ufology

1262
00:57:28,960 --> 00:57:27,220
hey so I think it's a really fascinating

1263
00:57:30,910 --> 00:57:28,970
structure

1264
00:57:34,450 --> 00:57:30,920
than anyone in the public not just those

1265
00:57:36,089 --> 00:57:34,460
interested in UFOs can really digest you

1266
00:57:39,370 --> 00:57:36,099
know well actually with that book the

1267
00:57:41,800 --> 00:57:39,380
365 days a UFO s a few people actually

1268
00:57:44,260 --> 00:57:41,810
said so me you didn't know each other

1269
00:57:45,609 --> 00:57:44,270
but they said that what the first one

1270
00:57:49,150 --> 00:57:45,619
they did was actually see what happened

1271
00:57:51,190 --> 00:57:49,160
on their birth which everybody you

1272
00:57:52,510 --> 00:57:51,200
probably do that yeah yeah I'm gonna go

1273
00:57:54,040 --> 00:57:52,520
back and look at what happened you have

1274
00:57:55,599 --> 00:57:54,050
a state yeah

1275
00:58:00,330 --> 00:57:55,609
Nick thank you so much you're welcome

1276
00:58:04,630 --> 00:58:02,710
that's it for this week's episode be

1277
00:58:06,760 --> 00:58:04,640
sure to check out the prolific Nick

1278
00:58:09,430 --> 00:58:06,770
Redferns collection of books at any

1279
00:58:11,740 --> 00:58:09,440
bookstore or online and be sure to get

1280
00:58:14,339 --> 00:58:11,750
flying saucers in the Kremlin right now

1281
00:58:16,900 --> 00:58:14,349
they're Lisa Hagan books and on Amazon

1282
00:58:18,730 --> 00:58:16,910
you may have seen me put a call out for

1283
00:58:21,010 --> 00:58:18,740
this on Facebook or Twitter recently

1284
00:58:23,890 --> 00:58:21,020
that's right it is time once again for

1285
00:58:26,020 --> 00:58:23,900
another volume of witness accounts if

1286
00:58:28,330 --> 00:58:26,030
you have a compelling UFO sighting

1287
00:58:30,430 --> 00:58:28,340
encounter or experience you'd like to

1288
00:58:33,520 --> 00:58:30,440
share on the show this is your chance

1289
00:58:35,859 --> 00:58:33,530
these episodes consists of only listener

1290
00:58:38,290 --> 00:58:35,869
accounts and they are by far some of the

1291
00:58:39,609 --> 00:58:38,300
most popular episodes to date so if

1292
00:58:41,589 --> 00:58:39,619
you'd like to be a part of it and to

1293
00:58:43,960 --> 00:58:41,599
discuss further and submit your account

1294
00:58:46,270 --> 00:58:43,970
reach out to me personally on facebook

1295
00:58:49,300 --> 00:58:46,280
twitter or use the contact tab on the

1296
00:58:51,190 --> 00:58:49,310
website somewhere in the skies be sure

1297
00:58:53,320 --> 00:58:51,200
to subscribe rate and review somewhere

1298
00:58:54,940 --> 00:58:53,330
in the skies on Avatar gasps your

1299
00:58:57,550 --> 00:58:54,950
Android apps or wherever you get the

1300
00:58:59,770 --> 00:58:57,560
show it helps tremendously we're on

1301
00:59:02,200 --> 00:58:59,780
Twitter at summer skies and Instagram at

1302
00:59:03,970 --> 00:59:02,210
summer skies pod all past episodes

1303
00:59:05,980 --> 00:59:03,980
articles and the official some when the

1304
00:59:07,870 --> 00:59:05,990
sky store is all available on the

1305
00:59:10,240 --> 00:59:07,880
website again that's somewhere in the

1306
00:59:12,820 --> 00:59:10,250
skies calm I'll see you here next week

1307
00:59:16,750 --> 00:59:12,830
for an exclusive interview with the man

1308
00:59:19,240 --> 00:59:16,760
the myth the weirdo John il10 II get

1309
00:59:26,090 --> 00:59:19,250
ready and remember keep your feet on the

1310
01:00:03,870 --> 01:00:01,590
[Music]

1311
01:00:06,339 --> 01:00:03,880
[Applause]

1312
01:00:08,079 --> 01:00:06,349
somewhere in the skies is produced by

1313
01:00:10,029 --> 01:00:08,089
Third Kind productions in association

1314
01:00:11,829 --> 01:00:10,039
with the entertainment one podcast